Giant Pandas

0:02 I'm Gideon from the burning Vale podcast and you for listening to the infinite Rabbit Hole. Keep it up guys, you doing a great job. You're at the zoo with your family, you get to see the exotic animals like the Lemurs gorillas tigers and so much more. There's that cool dinosaur exhibit. That just opened your older brother was telling you all All about how cool it's supposed to be since the displays move around. You just can't wait to get going as the day goes on. You get to see all these cool animals, but the one animal you really, really want to see is a panda. You're begging everyone to hurry up telling them, that the kangaroos aren't even that cool.

1:04 And we should just move on already. Finally, the crowd gets moving and you get to those big fluffy goofballs. You watch with pure joy, as they munch on their bamboo and be their clumsy selves as cute as a panda. Maybe though, there might be more to this animal. They were once considered to be a Cryptid after all. Now, I know this might seem like an odd topic, All Things Considered but there's Panda, folklore, history and theories that I think are very worth sharing. So today, we dive deep into everything. That is the giant panda. Welcome back. Back to infinite rabbit hole.

2:14 What do you have against tribal music you and your tribal music tribal music anyways? But that be said, Jake, how's it going? Well, introduce you first thing. Well, I'm sick. But I'm eating cheese. It's so it's not all that bad. Nice. Jesus really damn good. So Awesome fun times it. Yeah, fine. And Jeremy, how you doing today? Well, I am doing doing all right, doing. All right, kind of, kind of excited about this.

2:55 You've, you've talked it up quite a bit and I had so much fun doing this research actually. Like it's I don't want to spoil anything but it's It's a funny one. It's a silly one for sure. And you'll understand why, but I think it was worth it a discussion. Nonetheless, it which is why I wanted to do it? Well, I'm not going to make the mistake of underestimating you this time. Thank you, not the snow. And no threats of firing or anything. No, no not at all because we've already been fired. Ha ha ha. I I tried really hard because again, like I know I've said it to people, I'm doing I'm researching giant pandas, and everyone's like, excuse me what? Why what's the point, why are you doing a panda? Well, is there aliens, you're gonna find out why I'm doing the patent, okay?

3:54 It caught my attention. It was very interesting to me. And I wanted to do something kind of out of the norm for us. So here we are. I am. I'm very excited because I pulled up 14 pages of stuff to read for you for everybody here today. So just on pandas, that's fantastic. I mean I I'm aware of the whole Panda lure of the you know, how they used to be a corrupted and it took forever to actually prove that they existed but I don't know too much, I don't know a lot. I just know that they were and that's about it. So I'll add some cool things about pandas doing this too. So I don't know nothing so perfect. And this right here, I just want to throw this out quickly because I did not include it in the information, my research but a group of pandas is called an embarrassment. It's just like what I said, a group of jackalopes is called a flagger.

5:02 Doot. Same idea, group of Pandas is called an embarrassment. And in all honesty, they're kind of embarrassing animals. So it makes sense. It's freaking awesome. We'll get into that though. So with that being said, you guys ready? You got anything else? You have to say, announcements? Anything you guys want. Throw up before we dive into pandas, um, Well, I think by the time this episode comes out, this may be the last episode or the last week that you can purchase something from the from the merchant. I think that's or maybe not. Maybe this is too late. I don't know. Yeah, it's too late.

5:43 Well, oh, well sexier. Listen, if your socks are the suck nerd. No, we're gonna get anything anyway. So it doesn't matter. True. We know who you are now, but nope. I don't have any announcements or nothing like that. Everything is kind of smooth sailing right now. We're kind of just going with the flow and taking our time, you know, diving into our next documentary type series, but think we're going to take things a little bit slower. These these black hole conversation episodes of just been pretty sweet and we've gotten some pretty good feedback. So maybe we'll do a little bit more of these were just BSN and then You know, maybe we'll put a little bit more time into the documentary type episodes that we can really make them hit just just it just hits differently. You know, you mentioned the hate mail thing. Oh hey Bill, no, we didn't we didn't but not recently, we have not recently though whirring good, you do? Oh yeah, just kind of throwing out some funny ideas for conversation and stuff.

6:53 If you have any sort of complaints about the show, Send us an email and we will read it in one of our upcoming episodes. No, no. Leave us a voicemail. Tell us yourself and we'll play it and you can tell the world yourself, okay? Either way, all your infinite radical complaints. That's what you should do. Leave us a voicemail. I would love to hear your voice. Telling us your complaints and praise and whatever else you want to tell us. Let's hear it. I want to voice mail. Either way, Option, One Voice. No, but if you want to hide behind a keyboard like what was that? What was that guy's name? Come on somebody. Somebody knows it.

7:34 Somebody knows it. Yeah. Digital assassin. Digital asshat. That's right. Yeah you want to hide behind a keyboard like digital asset? Go ahead? Maybe we should believe it out. That's weird. Well, here's the thing is that we're not going to we're not going to go on a rant about it. Like last time and be like, oh well, you don't know nothing and freaking out and stuff it, we're gonna be poking fun at At it. So yeah, I mean if you got something you want to complain about it, you know, even if it's satire, you know, telling us that, you know, you hate Jeremy's beard and this is y or, you know, I've got a big nose and it has ruined your life, just looking at it, you know, something, we're will read it all out, there. We think it'd be kind of funny to kind of go through that.

8:14 And then the next episode talking about all of our, you know, positive reviews and comments and stuff, and just read every single one of them. And then who knows, maybe make that a yearly routine of just being a, here's all the hate. All that we've acquired over the years, that let's do a weekly. We have we don't get enough hate mail for that but that's what I said. Yeah. Because you get more and you know, us to get more. Yeah. Just just not clear one star reviews. Just no no even if you have something bad to say still give us 5 Stars. Yeah there you go. That's the best way to get our attention. This is the worst podcast I've ever heard five stars. One star reviews are like a kick in the balls. Don't do that, come on, that's that's cheap. The don't review it Community.

9:04 If you're gonna give us one star, please talk to us like an adult through the keyboards, okay? But, but to be clear, no, I will not be poking fun at anybody other than digital asset that is that's become a personal Vendetta. There has been plenty more. I promise you that I have not Poked fun at it is just against that one individual and Mel Gibson, not a big fan. I'm gonna I'm gonna bleep out every single time you said that like you're just cussing against baby panda. Nope. Oh boy.

9:44 So real quick, I just want to say I had one of the reasons I had so much fun in this with this research is because I was able to pull like little aspects. There's parts of this. There's parts of my script here that remind me of all three you guys which I thought was hilarious and it worked really well. And I thought it was really really fitting. So, with that being show up. Yeah. Jeff screw. That guy. We let him. I'm gonna tell him. You said that he's not going to care. You're right. Very right. I'm gonna tell him that Ken's are listen to all of his episodes on his show. He's been doing really and I'm gonna be like, no, she's lying, but have anyways.

10:31 Yeah, I'm ready. Ready? And has, okay, here we go. Okay, here we go. So what is a panda and where do they come from? You're muted. How the hell? Did I get muted? Who pick me? Pick me up. Tell you rude. And it's come from Mars. Anyways, we'll try that again. What is a panda? And where do they come from? We're all we're all aware of what a panda bear looks like this cute ball fluff with black eyes, ears, arms and legs.

11:15 They're creatures that are endemic to China. Meaning that the panda is only found in one state Nation country island, Etc, and only found, and they're only found within a few mountain ranges of China. It was said that it was said that around 20 to 30 thousand years ago. Pandas were found in 16 different provinces. Aces of China. But today they are only found in the provinces of Sichuan shaanxi and Gansu China made the panda, a protected species in 1962 with offenders facing ten plus years in prison and even death, they take the care of their national emblem.

11:55 Very seriously, I want to go over some Chinese folklore, Chinese folk lore and history is very fascinating and has been has been extremely well documented Thousands of years. All sorts of different stories have been passed down stories such as the Jade Rabbit, the legend of the white snake, or even stories about dragons. There is even plenty of fork folklore on Bears. Even the panda bear, including a couple variations of the story about how the pandas got their markings. This story is called the pandas and the shepherdess and goes as such a shepherdess named dolma was living in the whoo. Oolong Valley and was loved by all she would take her sheep into the surrounding Hills every day and each day and all white panda, Cub known as Bay Xiang would join the flock. It was believed the panda.

12:49 Did this thinking the Sheep were other pandas one day? While enjoying the nice weather, a leopard suddenly attacked and grabbed the young Panda. Cub dolma instinctively, grabbed a large stick and started swinging at the leopard, causing it to drop the panda and turn its attention on to dolma. Unfortunately, she did not make it. Word of Damas fate spread very quickly and then and when other pandas heard of the tragic event, they became very sad and gathered to mourn the loss. At the time, it was customary to rub the ashes of a loved one on your arms to show respect. So, this is exactly what the pandas did. However, they were so grief-stricken.

13:30 They cried and stop. So, loudly while wiping their eyes and covering their ears to block Some Noise doing this, they rubbed black, ash all over themselves and to this day, pandas still carried. Those black markings, as a reminder of the young shepherdess to add to this, Story Dolmas. Three sisters were so upset. They threw themselves into Dolmas grave, which caused the Earth to shake and Rumble as the mountain, as a mountain was created from their grave. The Four Sisters mountain also known as Mount signal, Yang represents each sister, and it's Four, Peaks and is said to guard.

14:12 And protect the pandas to this day. There are other versions of the story, one of which has a mother Panda as As the panda Cub both which did not make it out of the leper Tech leopard attack despite the effort of the shepherdess who also did not make it the pandas gathered to mourn their loss, covering their arms with Ash, never washing it off so they would have a constant reminder of the brave shepherdess. Other accounts of these stories say that the four sisters were working together to kill the leopard and after the sister's funeral, the pandas created the mountains, out of the sisters bodies, What do you guys think of that story? I think it's pretty interesting.

14:53 I mean so far there's not much that we can argue about this is lure, right? I don't believe the story is true. You, what's what? I'm debunking it right now. Also 10 years in prison to life, that's an expensive hamburger even death. Oh yeah, that's what I'm seeing. Yeah, that's an expensive am burger, right? Maybe I was that was like, Mike. They've changed that law a few times over the years, I think, now it's they no longer kill the person, but you can face up to life. In jail. Now, if you're caught messing with a panda, they take their pandas very seriously out there. Well, they're one of the most endangered animals in the world, aren't they?

15:43 They are no longer actually endanger their now the next step. Well, you know what? That means. Open, Sea Open Season. Oh no, I've been labeled as I can't remember the word. They're no longer considered endangered though, there's enough out there that they can. They're on the verge of endangerment, but there's enough out there that they could still sustain a wild population. Don't pandas like, they're so lazy that they don't even like we're gonna get there first to do it. We're going to get there. Don't technically, you could have the entire world filled with pandas and eventually they die out.

16:26 Yeah, we're gonna get there. Don't you worry. It gets better. It gets been way better. The next step is vulnerable. Battling. The worst is extinct extinct in the wild critically endangered and dangered. Vulnerable near threatened conservation, dependent least, concern data deficient and non evaluated. That's what Bigfoot is not evaluated. Make sense and Panda sits at vulnerable. So there you go. They are. yeah, they've I want to give too much away because I do talk about that but they've Created a big enough population but the unfortunate part is this not just the wild population that they're accounting for so damn kid.

17:21 Jump into it are pandas even actually bears. But they like big raccoons or something. They are bears, actually. Yeah. Someone's going to say I'm really heartless for talking about killing panda bears but people, they are not. But I got a section about that too. So quit trying to jump ahead. Jacob, I'm just answering a question. Little known fact. The pandas scientific name is Ursa Oreos. And Cream. I mean, sure it's not but we can go with that. True.

18:02 It is not. I don't know what it is. I would know I did the research. Did you, do you know? I don't have it in here but I did come across its scientific name a few times. It's a yellow Taylor Rowe Pota melon lyokha. Yeah, that's it sure. Yep. All right. I'm ready to go. Bunch of fancy words that Ken's are can't pronounce, which is why she left it out. Okay. We ready for the next part? Yeah. Over the years, many different names have been given to the giant panda. Like mentioned earlier, the panda used to be found in 16 different Chinese provinces. So there's no wonder the panda might have had so many different names.

18:52 Some of these names include picks. You the pig. See, you was depicted as a very large animal. It Was Written in the analysis, also known as the biographies of the five Emperor's that emperor. Hwang used to keep a picks you to use for fighting the stories. Tell that as early as four thousand years ago, the emperor Had A Tribe Called whoo-hoo anxiety, and they used tamed animals, such as leopards, bears, tigers. And even the Peaks you they named the pixie. Oh, but sorry. The name pxu was also used in reference to ancient. What Warriors to symbolize their victory in all wars? Mo was another name used some ancient texts, tell stories of an animal that was remarkably tough with teeth that could bite through iron and bamboo joints.

19:53 And was known by the name of Mo stories, tell of Mo being held in hunting areas, since hunting, the mou was considered to be an act of strength because of its ability to bite through Metals, it was nicknamed The Iron eating animal. These stories also come with reports that people were afraid. afraid of the mou because of its ability because of its ability to eat through metals, Another name used was dae-jung mouth. Meaning Great Bear cat. This name was used because of the pandas rounder face, sort of like a cat's and the fat figure look more like a bear later. The Chinese writing system was reformed and the official Chinese name for the bear became Zhang now. White Bear.

20:43 This name was given to help emphasize how the panda is, a symbol of peace to this date. China offers pandas to Nations as a guest, your for peaceful relations other names, include China bear because it's rare animal endemic to China, giant raccoon because of its physical resemblance to a raccoon or silver dog. Red. Pandas are locally known as golden dog. So silver dog just seemed to make sense. Another interesting fact about this that I found was the panda is very commonly referred to as the yin and yang the yin and yang story in history. Pandas have been known to be somewhat scary yet, strong creatures, but as people started to do research on pandas, they quickly learned, that pandas are, in fact, quite peaceful and very kind combine, this with the unforgettable black and white fur coat.

21:37 You have a physical living symbol of the yeah. The yin-yang a creature considered to have Warrior like qualities and has a personality completely opposite of that. I did happen to stumble upon some information that claimed pandas had some kind of medicinal value as well during the Ming Dynasty. A well-known pharmacists, leashes. N made several claims that different parts of pandas had healing values things such as the panda fur making. Excellent dry bedding. How pending urine? Could dissolve any kind of metals, that may have been ingested and Panda fat was stored in Stone containers and was said to treat swelling.

22:26 Sleeping with a pelt warded off diseases. And just some, this is just some interesting than this is just some interesting information that I had never heard before making Panda history just that much cooler. What do you guys think? I looked it up. I wanted to Bunk it so bad, apparently, there's no cases of a panda mauling a human Wild. You can find, that's why I don't think they're actual Bears because bears are Godless killing machines. Pandas are not Bears then.

23:08 Fair. That's a fair thought. Then fact about bears. Make some really scary is there. The only land mammal that will kill you water will eat. You be killing? Yeah. Yeah, they don't even stop to make sure your dad, did you start eating you? I'm even more afraid of this man, thinks there's don't just start eating you. I don't dull. Just rip your guts out while you're watching it. Yeah, we're as like, you know, cats wolves all the other big bads, right? They'll At least go for your neck. Kill you before before they start like, you know, it's make sure your business that were. They got the zombie idea. That from then zombies just fucking tear you apart and each of us you're alive maybe. Oh no, I mean, it is a pretty terrifying aspect of the right that I've already not work but ever want to go through that. I mean, it's the whole world gets different once you get into, like, reptiles and, and Aquatic species, because a lot of those, we'll just the same thing like crocodiles alligators, do.

24:08 Just start eating. It's a lizard. Brain in them. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Jake. You know what? Yeah. Elizabeth. Yeah. Those are great. Um. So at what point were pandas deemed to be, you know, needing to be preserved to the point where we're going to imprison people and kill them. If the was at one point, they were saying that well got there like most ancient cultures random body parts of certain animals. So this will cure leprosy and this little do that and this will do this and drink the urine because it'll dissolve Well apparently like it was just, you know, hit or miss people were just kind of winging it. Yeah.

24:54 And like every culture in the world did it. But like I want to know where the, where the stop was where they're like, oh this isn't true and also we should protect these things. So I kind of get into that a little bit later here. Okay? You love to jump ahead. You, you've done this several times. I'm just returning the favor of you guys getting. So here's what I can tell you right now is pandas. From my research pandas throughout Chinese history, were always viewed as these very strong, very scary animals. They were used as they were used by a and whatnot for for protection, for hunting, for the whole nine yards. This Emperor, I mentioned Emperor. Who Aang, he, I guess.

25:55 He had a very specific hunting grounds that he only is that he kept a lot of pandas in that he used specifically just to go hunting or when he had to go to war or whatever the case may be. But he used these animals, these were very prized animals to him. They if anybody hurt his animals, they were gonna get hurt themselves, kind of idea. They were feared, they were very feared animals. People were totally Fide of the panda. There was a little bit of a transition at some point, which I do talk about, but I find it what I can tell you right now is the panda.

26:38 Was used as a fighting animal according to Folklore and history at one point like a dog fighting kind of thing kind of. Yeah. It's but then again, you bring in the whole medicinal aspect of it. It kind of adds to this in my personal opinion, without jumping too far. Ahead it adds to its endangerment. Your this animal was Oh yeah, they butchered him by the millions. Probably. Yeah, they wanted. It was so highly regarded. They wanted the Pelt. They wanted the fat, the whole nine yard the urine, the whole nine yards, right? So they were hunting the animal. And it got to that point of when we finally discovered it, that's when it was at, its end point of point of endangerment, right?

27:26 The whole nine yards. Again, I feel like I'm giving too much away, but I do explain a lot more of that coming up. Well, I mean that's totally believable. I mean, look at them. They're absolutely gorgeous animals. Oh, yeah. The uniqueness of the color patterns plus the, you know, I mean, black and white, does pop up quite a bit in nature. It's not that rare, obviously, your beiges and Browns, or, and your solid. Blacks are more more popular or you're solid. Eight is more popular, but in its it is a very unique looking pattern itself like a zebra, right? Has stripes.

28:11 If you think of like other animals that are black and white like a house cat, you get a plethora of different patterns that I could possibly come in, but the pattern of the pattern, the panda is the same. It's it it's it's very it's strange but at the same time, it's very unique. Eek and I could see where the want is. I mean, look at all the people who want, you know, skins of other animals, you know, like the black bear? No, it's the black belt. I mean, imagine the pet possum, people tell me I'm fucking weirdo, but I want to pet possum. Yeah, it's pretty weird. I don't care if I want to pause here. I want to domesticated pet possum, okay?

28:53 I think the interesting thing about bears or pandas is that Animals. The birds are a completely different story because they can fly generally, some can't, but most animals seem to have some kind of Pelt, that's reminiscent of where they live in order to provide active camouflage, right? But the panda, I mean, unless I don't know off top my head. There's a snowy season where they reside? But I wouldn't think so. So since they feet they eat bamboo which is like a lowland type plan but that's my understanding.

29:38 But their Pelt wouldn't a provide any sort of active camouflage for them which would which is very interesting. It's pretty cool. So no. Pandas, I can't remember if it's a if I actually put this in here or not, but pandas don't have a natural predator. Hey. They are just there, there's nothing out there that really hunts them other than humans. Well, they're going to learn, they did learn it. Sure. Yeah but yeah, I can't remember if I actually put that information tidbit of information, but if I recall correctly, pandas, don't have a natural predator. There's they, they are just there. There's nothing out there.

30:27 They are their worst enemy. Well, I don't mean to be a buzzkill here, kid. I just quickly did a quick Google search on that one mind, you keep in mind before you continue, that was not information. That I was actually looking for, because I didn't think it was necessary. So you're good, you're good, you're good, you're good. Um, the the Jackal snow leopard and yellow-throated, Martin are all capable of killing and eating panda cubs. It's not dancing like a weasel Cubs. Yes, I Specifically talking about a panoramic extremely vulnerable, I'm talking about full-grown, pandas pan, right? Full-grown pandas. Don't have a natural predator, right?

31:08 And I definitely see that but, you know, just just throw it out there. There is a time of their life where they could eat it. Eat it by a young supported Mark, but are the Pub's colored the same, or are they like deer where there they have the spots and all that sort of stuff, and then it changes over time, okay? So just to put things in perspective, I do get into the actual like numbers and whatnot for this, but when a panda is born, they are about maybe 2 inches long, 3 inches, long compared to the mother which is again. I got the numbers in here somewhere but I think they're like 119 hundredth the size of their mother. Yeah, I are heinie.

31:56 They stick this little tiny bead of a living thing in their armpit to keep it warm. Yeah, it looks like a little rat, like a little more pink. They come up pink. They don't come out colored anything like that. Yes, exactly. Yeah. That's a that's not a marsupial. No. Yes. Okay, not a mercy. But yes, are we return more? They might be, I don't know. Once you go check what we see. Really. Yeah, your plan of a roulade, kangaroos taste, good kangaroos, make some good meat on them anyway, Kid. But yeah, we ready for the next part then take your way.

32:40 Okay. The panda wasn't known by any other part of the world until 1869. When father Armand, David was given a panda skin and sent it back to Paris to have it analyzed, Armand. David was a Catholic priest as well as zoologist and botanist. He spent quite a few years in China for data and specimen collection. And at the request of the French government, some items of his collection were sent to Paris for further examination. This did include the panda skin. He had found over 200 different species of birds, insects reptiles and other creature that at the time were completely unknown. He had also discovered the père David dear or the Father, David dear sent, he sent to the first sample of the emerald, ash borer as well as being credited for the discovery of the giant panda.

33:39 Father, David wrote in his journal, when I was on my way. Way back to church. I was invited to have arrested, mr. Lee's home in his home, I saw the pandas skin. It's big. It's big and beautiful colored black and white. The skin was quite peculiar. Lee told me that I would see this animal very soon for his Hunters were going to hunt it, it seemed that a new species in the science domain will be found two weeks later when the hunters had returned with a panda bear, he claimed that he quote, believed it to be a new species, not only because of the skin color, but also because of the hair beneath its feet and other characteristics, A German zoologist named Hugo. We gold was the first person to own a live panda bear. An expedition calls called the stoats, Nur Expedition took place in 1916.

34:38 And is when we gold saw the first wild panda. He later, purchased a young Panda Cub. Unfortunately, I was unable to find any sort of information on this Expedition, but between 1869 and 1929, Many different Expeditions were done in attempt to find a Panda. Most of these were ultimately unsuccessful in their book in their book cryptozoology, A to Z, Loren Coleman and Jerome Clark quoted Anthropologist George a gonio saying, quote from 1869 to 1929 a period of 60 years, a dozen.

35:21 Well, staffed and well-equipped professional Zoological collecting teams unsuccess unsuccessfully sought an animal, the size of a small bear in a restricted area, the giant panda lives in the same general area and the same general, elevation six to twelve thousand feet as the yeti. At this animal remained hidden hidden for over 60 years. 1928 to 1929 was the year that the Kelly Roosevelt's Expedition took place. This expedition was sponsored by William V Kelly who was a field museum trustee and benefactor and was said to be very well equipped for this endeavor.

36:05 The Expedition itself was broken up into three sections. The first was led by the Roosevelt Brothers, Kermit and Theodore jr. The second was led by British Herbert Stevens and the last was led by HJ cool Rich. The brothers ended up being the first westerners to find and kill a giant panda. Later writing a book about their experience titled trailing the giant panda, which was first published in 1929 an expert, an excerpt from an article. I found on the book is as follows. Quote, the Kelley Roosevelt Field Museum Expedition, which penetrated into the wild portions of the union and Szechuan Central China were the object of the trip.

36:56 Sorry, the Kelly Roosevelt Field Museum Expedition which penetrated into the wild portions of Yunnan and Sichuan Central China, where the objects of the trip was attained in the shooting of a fine specimen of the giant. Panda of the bamboo jungles discovered 60 years ago by PR David, the French missionary scientist, but searched for, in a van by subsequent subsequent hunters and naturalist. This finding was a big deal for a lot of people but other than but another Panda wouldn't be found until seven years later in 1936 sparking, what is called pandemonium Ruth.

37:41 Harkness was a materialistic. Woman Fashion Designer socialite and animal trafficker. Her husband had left to find a Panda in 1934, but died of cancer early 1936 while in China. So Ruth traveled to Anna to finish. What her husband had started that same year. She wrapped a panda cub in her coat and brought it back to the US. This nine-week-old Panda that was named Su Lin was the first live panda in the United States. Suelen, meaning a little bit of something. Very cute was eventually placed in the Chicago Brookfield Zoo. Harkness went on to more expeditions in search of the panda.

38:25 Bringing back a second Panda named Meimei in 1937 but was unsuccessful on her third Expedition. She went on to write a few books. One about Sue Ellen called the baby giant panda, as well as her book, The Lady and the panda both published in 1938. Harkness may have been the first person to bring a panda to the Western World. However, she most definitely was not the last to do. So Soo Lin came to America in 1936 and over the next decade 14. Different pandas were taken from China by foreigners. China started to have some issues with this and in 1946 decided, to no longer allow foreigners to exploit pandas like they had been in 1957, China started to gift.

39:14 As to other nations not only as a sign of Goodwill. But also as a guest, your friendship between the nations in the 1960s for of the world's first Panda was reserves were created and the pandas added to the list of animals that cannot be hunted. After a nature, decree was issued prohibiting people from hunting, several different animals. It was discovered in the early 70s. Through DNA testing the panda was a member of the bear family, which of course peaked His interest. This was new information. China went on to do a census and to and determined there were only about 2,400 pandas in the wild, which led to more field.

39:54 Studies of the animal in 1979, the chairman of the World, Wildlife, Foundation, or WWF, signed an agreement with Beijing, this agreement allowed for conservation of animals around the world and the panda was the first conservation project that they had agreed upon. Pain. What do you guys think of that? Very cool. It's a lot there but a history. Yeah. There's actually I was quite surprised with panda history if you go I included in my sources so people can go check it out. But if you go to the WWF website, you can actually see all of the panda history and it's quite a lengthy page of information.

40:50 And it's, I think the most recent update, was from 2016 or 17, I may may be wrong about that, but it's quite the lengthy page of information, and I was pleasantly surprised about how much Panda history there is from 1867 to today, Very cool. What? Okay, I gotta ask, what, what got you on the topic? There's a conspiracy behind pandas. There's a major conspiracy behind and he's painters are fake hashtag, right? Yes let's that's what got me interested and that's where we're headed. So, when I said earlier that this aspect had a little bit of each of you in it.

41:41 Panda used to be a Cryptid. So there's the Jeremy part. I've got a Jeff part and then I finish it with a jake part, okay? So the finisher move calling it the morning. You got. I think that everybody's going to love this. I think the listeners are going to really enjoy this. Come, the end of the episode. That's I was really excited for this because I could, I was able to pull a little aspects of all of us and put it into this. I was able to find a topic that was a little bit off course, for us that still fit What we're about in the whole nine yards. I thought this was fun and this was cool and I thought it was worth a discussion clerical.

42:24 Let's do it. Oh, I looked into I use the Google box while you were speaking. And I don't think I've ever seen a panda Cub before, not like the little pink rat one, but I mean, the one they actually have fur and they're just small right now. Look, exactly. Like, they look exactly like the adults saying hair patterns. Everything. Yeah, that being said, though, I did, I doubt that they do very well in the snow and that they have to be in temperatures lower than 77 degrees Fahrenheit or like 25 degrees Celsius or something like that so they don't know that. Yeah, from time for me, so they seek out colder areas.

43:05 So I mean, yeah, if they spend a certain amount of time in the snow than their hair, pattern would make sense but every other time it wouldn't but But still a unique looking animal, for sure. They tend to go up and down mountains. And so they're probably going between two different climates there. One. Hmm. One day they're hanging out in snow in the next, they're hanging out in the Green Bamboo Forest. So it's probably a little bit of both because it's up and down the mountain, you know. Yeah I could be wrong. I I don't know. 100%, I've never seen a panda in the wild so never never not once because they don't exist, exactly. I wonder if they could get mean.

43:50 I'm sure I mean the guy used they can the emperor used them for hunting and and battles and stuff. I'm sure they could be trained to rip an arm off. They definitely. Can I talk about that a little bit, not too too much, but they definitely can't. They do have a violent streak to them. Mmm-hmm. Yeah. Godless killing machines. So they are bears. Okay. Yep. You ready for this expert? You're gonna like this next part Jeremy. So it's just what are you? You let's do it. You ready? Okay, here we go, dr. George Schaller isn't a german-born. American mammalogist, biologist, conservationist and author who is known mostly for his work involved with the mountain gorilla conservation in 1980.

44:38 He was invited by WWF to conduct field research for the conservation of the panda during his time, in the field Schaller, discovered that pandas were actually carnivorous creatures. And believed that they had adapted over time as a way to avoid fighting for food with other species, he had also stated that he believed that pant, the panda had no problem, surviving in the wild and perhaps the animals Newfound popularity is the reason the panda population seem to have taken a hit. Since his initial research Expedition, for the panda, the wild population had increased by 45%, he even made a claim. That the panda pelts were used for Thracian. Menstrual treatments in the third century. Something about dr.

45:25 Schaller that I thought would be worth the mention. He is one of the few scientists out there that argue we should actually be looking further into Bigfoot Schaller has been described as a skeptic. However, he also has a great disapproval for anyone who dismisses Bigfoot as a myth or hoax saying that quote a hard I'd look is absolutely needed. I couldn't agree more, the research done by the doctor would be the basis for panda knowledge for many years to come, but there was still so much that we had to learn about pandas in their behaviors. As a result between 1983 and 1987. There were over 30 panda cubs.

46:09 Taken from the wild and placed in captivity we weren't yet aware that Mama pandas will leave their young for up to 50 hours so they can go foraging. This was also the decade China started to loan, pandas out to zoos and other countries for a fee of up to 1 million u.s. dollars. The next big research project on pandas and their environment, didn't take place until 1985 288. The results of this survey showed that there were only 1114 pandas in the wild. This came as a surprise since the previous survey estimated about 2459, pandas, In the 90s, some people started having issues with China loaning out, they're loaning out the pandas to other countries.

46:56 There was a decent amount of money to be made from zoo-goers. All wanting to see a panda. And China was also gaining Runner revenue from this loaning system. So it just seemed to be a win-win for everybody. However, there were International conservation groups that wanted to stop the commercial use of pandas explaining, the negative impact that it could have on the wild population. If the Exploitation continued. Starting in 1999 and continuing to 2003, the ministry of Forestry and world and the World Wildlife Foundation partnered up to conduct a much more in-depth survey. The goal was to gain more knowledge and a better understanding of things such as the animal's habitat and the population, an attempt to better the conservation.

47:44 Efforts the results of this survey weren't released until 2004 revealing that there were only about thousand 596 pandas in the wild. The data collected also showed that the area the pandas lived in the wild had decreased by over 114 km2 or 44, square miles. Leaving a total of twenty twenty-three thousand 49 square kilometers or 8899 square miles. Meanwhile, there were other studies being done on how the pandas were currently in kept. Meanwhile, there were other panda.

48:25 Meanwhile, there were other studies being done on. How many pandas were currently in captivity, and by 1999, they revealed there was a population of 467 captive pandas over the years. They have also been many, many people who have been punished for the illegal poaching or trafficking of a panda. These crimes were punishable by death until 1997 when it changed to a 20-year or life prison sentence. Now, I want to quickly touch base on an incident that took place in 1987. 288 referred to as the pain, an fake panda incident December of 1987, a private zoo in Tanana. Taiwan announced that they had a panda bear on display. There wasn't much of a story to the incident. However, the zoo didn't have a real panda bear. They had taken a sun bear and painted it to look like a panda, the display lasted, a total of ten days. He's shutting down on January, third of 98, after a group of experts.

49:31 Determine the animal was in fact fake. Another attempt to fake pandas with was made by a circus in Italy, back in 2014, the owner of said circus had falsified documents claiming. He had two real pandas in his possession and he had painted to Chow. Chow puppies to look like panda bears. He was then he then went and charge tourists to take pictures with these animals. Later. He was caught and charged for faking the documents and endangering animals. Hey buddy, bear with us while we take this quick break. I have seen people painting their dogs so I like pandas, and they are so cute.

50:19 I know they're adorable. I love the whole painting hair. Dyeing dogs thing. I think he's animals safe, Peyton hair, dyes, and paints. Now, since we're on the topic of bears, Jake, I'm pretty sure we brought this up before on the show. Naked bears. Hmm, they're terrifying. Oh my. My we've had this discussion. Yes. If you do, if you anybody listen to this right now wants to see one of the most horrifying things, look up a shaved bear or a naked bear. Now, the absolutely Guardians of The Nightmare realm. Yeah.

51:03 Most horrifying things that you could ever. Think of, I mean even picturing a bear without hair, doesn't do it justice, you have to look at them. I agree. Yeah it's gross. It's creepy but yes homeboy who thinks that we should be looking into Bigfoot. Definitely a smart man. I can I'll back that 100%. I felt that I needed to be out of there. Oh, you're right. Like we need it. I needed to share that with everybody. Great job. You see? I pulled Bigfoot in. I didn't even have to try. I did not even have to try there. You did great kid.

51:43 It. Yeah, you know, I agree that pandas are very interesting and like, how they don't eat meat because I mean, there's, there's various types of bears like we North Americans. I mean, we got our black bears and are brown bears or grizzly bears. You know, there's polar bears, sun bears, There's the Bears that have they're all black, except for that white like bat symbol on their chest. Those things, I mean, they'll tear people up. I saw this video of this guy in India that was like, taking a selfie with one in there, rip his arm off, it's crazy. And it's like, so that's one of the things really. That got me thinking that pandas weren't actually bears in the same way we call them, like, koala bears, but those aren't Bears.

52:39 Yeah, right. So I thought that The Bears was in the same sort of thing where it's not actually a bear, just called a panda bear. But yeah, very interesting that they don't eat meat in there. Scarcely, vegetarians not true. No, no, they're omnivorous. Omnivorous not technically. We're quite happy. They are and in a general sense. Yes, they are. But they eat their there then. So they're the babies their cards, but I can't breed. Well, I mean, I go more into detail, I think in this next part, but they, yes, they do. I'll just, okay, I'm just gonna dive into this, then if that I've been to it, Yeah, dive into it. We doing kid, jump jump, go now shut up. She's abusive.

53:36 Now that we've covered some Panda history. What have we learned about? Pandas over the years nothing Well, they're known to be these clumsy fluff fluff balls, rolling around happiest. Can be munching away on bamboo, but there's way more to a panda than just that. The average panda is about six feet long around, 220 pounds with a life span of 20 to 25 years and take up to 14 hours a day to eat, around 12 to 38, kg or 27 284 pounds of bamboo. Ooh, they also have an extended wrist bone, which acts almost like a thumb, allowing them to hang onto tough.

54:21 Bamboo shoots easily along with its very sharp teeth and Jaws to rip the bamboo a Bart. But something interesting is that a pandas is that pandas actually have the digestive system of a carnivore to prevent themselves from getting tummy aches they produce waste up to 50 times a day and that helps explain why they have to each soap. Eat so much food. It is believes, It is believed that pandas committed to Bamboo as a food source over 3, million years ago. So it's a bit of a mystery as to why the digestive system hasn't adapted accordingly. Pandas may be clumsy and unable to hunt but they still go to. They still enjoy a good steak every now and then and we'll eat meat when offered the opportunity.

55:07 Pandas are creatures that like to be left alone and tend to stay close to their home, they're fairly an expressive making the odd grunt or bar. They don't tend to roar like a bear. Well, they heavily rely on their smell using a special smell gland Jake. You're gonna love this located under their tail and surrounding the anus. Yeah, to rub against things like trees, are rocks to leave specific. Smells behind for other pandas. Yeah, male and female pandas use their sense as a bit differently. Male pandas, usually using it as a way to mark their territory while female pandas uses A sign for reproduction, but they also tend to use these sense to let other pandas know, if they want to make friends or be left alone.

56:01 Speaking of reproduction in the springtime female pandas ovulate only once a year for one to three days and just like a bear pandas have a delayed implantation basically. Meaning that if the conditions aren't totally right, the panda can use a certain mechanism within their body to prevent the embryo. Implantation, until the conditions are good enough. Hmm. And it is believed. This can last for up to a month. There are suggestions that this delay is a Out of the panda being at too. High of an altitude, others suggest that there isn't enough nutrients from the mother yet. Three to six months later, we have baby pandas.

56:42 Usually born as twins, Noob or pandas way about 4 ounces on average and are about 18 hundredths, the weight of the mother. All they can really do is squirm around and make some noises. Unfortunately, in most cases, only one of the two cups will survive and it is believed that the mother Panda has a hard time being able to handle both. So it just chooses to abandon one. Newborn pandas are born blind and without a fur coat. So they're very heavily depend on the mother for quite some time. Panda cubs will stay with the mothers for up to 23 years. And in order for the mother Panda to have another litter, she must be separated from her Cubs for this reason. Pandas only tend to have a litter every other year, despite the fact that pandas almost never have sex in captivity, there have been methods put in place to help twin Cubs survive. Zookeepers have taken the abandoned Cubs into their care and would very carefully attempt to swap the panda cubs without the mother seeing.

57:50 This was done, not only to keep both the comes alive, but to give each cup a chance to bond and feed with their mother, something that would not naturally happen in the wild. This does Present some challenges though. There have been stories of mother pandas, not wanting to give up the Cubs are currently caring for and it leaves the other Cub. Without the chance to nurse needless to say, it has some save it needless to say, it has saved some panda cubs. However, it's not a perfect system. Did you have the ability to climb? But they are very clumsy and not too good at it. The pandas that can climb or usually seen using their heads to assist them up the tree.

58:33 However, based off the pandas shape and size, it's fairly impressive that they can climb it. All I wanted to point out, one more random fact about the male pandas, they will actually be doing a handstand, especially when they're trying to mark their territory. It is believed that they do this. Ice. That is so that other pet to assure that other pandas, will catch the scent, and it increases the odor filled. They also will find wide trees with rough bark. Because these conditions tend to hold the scent. Better gotta admit. It makes the panda. Look pretty stupid other pictures of this. Yes, there is.

59:14 They're fantastic. So yeah, I mean a lot of animals have scent glands around the whole Bible. Where is it? If you really want to catch my attention, find an animal that like ejects, it's like pink socks itself and slapped it against trees or something like somebody into that. It seriously sounded like male pandas, especially will back their asset will walk their ass and up a tree and just start rubbing their ass on it and then carry on with life. And to me, that was the BS thing like they pee doing a handstand. That's already hilarious. Like pretty nice. The more I talk about it.

59:56 This is the embarrassment things start to make more sense. They're pretty embarrassing animals. Well, someone should tell them and maybe they'll knock it off. I don't think they care. You guys honesty. Just look at the picture. I just sent to the chat. It's these. Hello. It's like somebody dressed up as a pan for. He's Tikki. Careful, think you can sing too. Gosh I talked about that too. The pandas as soon as possible. But they know if oddly enough you're safe. You're saying they're trying to scar them when the reality is they're trying not to scare them.

1:00:40 The panda Devil comes out. That's what this looks like. Yep, Panda demon. This, this handstand peeing technique is wild. You don't keep the first time I saw. I heard that I was like, what the fuck what happened? Like why did I? I was so baffled by that. That. But then I actually looked into it and it made too much sense. It's they're smart. They're smart animals. They got there. They've got some smart achill particles up there. Yeah, they do.

1:01:25 That's funny. It's hilarious. Ready for the next part, then guys. Yeah, this one's a little bit shorter, but this is my Jeff part. Yes, ready. I can't wait for my part which is going to say, what sort of handed compliment as you're going to throw at me. No, it's I'm so excited. It's fun. Anyways. You ready? Yeah, I'm ready. So, what if I said, pandas are lab made a possible genetic Chimera, maybe, what is a chimera exactly? Well, a chimera is a single organism with more than one genotype.

1:02:11 There are many different ways, a chimera can present, but there have been evidence of chimeras mm in humans specifically in Twins and bone marrow transplant. Sip Ian's, could the panda possibly be a human bear Chimera or a raccoon bear. Chimera, I know that sounds absolutely Bonkers but people argue that due to how few and far in between Panda sightings have been the authentic, the authenticity of a panda is questionable and there are claims that you can't find any sort of folklore or history on pandas. If you Google pandas, sorry, if you Google are pandas, born female, you will get the answer.

1:02:55 Yes. All pandas are born, female. This is a big reason. Why people think that pandas are, in fact, a lab made creature using Jurassic Park. As an example, all the dinosaurs in the movie were lab made and all were born, female makes you wonder There's also the aspect that the panda was created to be nothing more than a political symbol, a way to show. Good faith and peace among nations. And as a tourist trap, all pandas are owned by China. Even the ones born in the US and other countries, China has the right to take back the pandas at anytime they want. And there's an extensive monitoring and data collection done daily, which then gets sent back to China Daily for their records but if any government was to Need a lab made creature. Do you think they would tell us about it or they find a way to use this creation to their advantage? Just to quickly.

1:03:54 Clear the air as I shared earlier, there's plenty of folklore and history on the panda. So people clearly aren't doing their research properly and not all pandas are born, female pandas don't actually start to develop genitalia until they're about 3 to 4 months old. So it's actually quite difficult to tell the gender of a panda without a blood test. This misinformation is the first thing that pops up on Google and is from a book that shares 100 facts about. Pandas, most of which are completely made up. Hmm. And this is why we don't use the Google box. Everybody just saying that's right we use your page 5 the Google box. Yeah let's break this down real quick. It doesn't have to necessarily be lab made think of the way that human beings have domesticated dogs. When they all were Wolves at one point. And then now we have ones that, you know, using the word lightly, we've evolved from that point two percent. To perform certain tasks or roles. And in other cases, we devolve them or devolve down our with the term is them to be like worthless like pugs and stuff where they can't even breathe, right? Or they have incredible like joint issues and stuff so I don't necessarily think it has to be lab made especially if there's history going back to the 1800s or, you know, specific Emperor's having you No, their

1:05:29 folklore about it or you know what? They did with the pandas and stuff but certainly they could be a part of a breeding program. They were created at some point by someone, who said, hey, let's take these couple animals or these two types of bears and buried them together and the result eventually was a panda that I mean, you can't look at world history and say that that's never happened before because you know all the different types of dogs. It absolutely has happened. You know, I have a dog called the Leonberger. That was specifically made by the Germans, to be like a giant German Shepherd that's 170 pounds. Mixed with Newfoundland English Mastiff and st. Bernard and you know, and he has some of those traits and you can kind of see that in the way he's built. But you know but and they in Lindbergh Germany, put a big statue of a bronze statue of a Leonberger. Her in the town square and that's like their pride and joy is that we created this animal, right? And it has a really interesting history through World War One World War Two and all that stuff. But regardless the pan it could be the exact same thing. It doesn't have to be a natural animal and I'm under the opinion that being a Bible believer.

1:06:48 And one of the questions is with the whole flood thing. Well how did every single various type of animal get put into the ark? Well, it was Kind of animal so bears and then over thousands of years, those became brown bears. Black bears polar bears, panda bears eventually right. So it just like it could have been like that or it could have just been a creation by someone. So, yeah. I'm actually on board with that and I think that that could have some validity to it and the fact that China owns these things like that, I don't know of any other country in the world that does that with their my knowledge and animals, you know?

1:07:28 Which is very strange to my knowledge. There's no other animal that is owned specifically by country Nation whatever. Okay. I I didn't there's a huge chunk of information that I could have put in this about that. However, it got really political really quickly and it was a little too much in my opinion for what we focus on. Yeah, it's It was it? I did nausea and chattel and yeah, yeah, it does exactly.

1:08:08 It's something that we want to talk about on Shadow bandwidth, not on infinite radical. So I didn't include it. But China uses the panda as a political symbol and Panda Express. Yes, yeah, the whole nine yards. Yeah, you know it and thank you panda movies. Yep. But like yeah, the panda. China has every right. If they if I believe there's a panda currently at the Calgary Zoo up here in Canada, if China decided they got mad at cat, they wanted to be mad at Canada. Pandas ours, send it back right now and we have no choice.

1:08:51 We have to pack that Panda up and we have to send it back. That moment, red exit overnight, literally literally is what we have to do. There is 24/7 cameras on A Pandit was somebody constantly monitoring the pandas writing down, details taking data collecting this information and then that information gets sent back to China. At the end of the day, every single day, because they want to monitor their animals because they own every single one of these, most of these animals are given out, especially nowadays. I don't know if there's still a loaning system in place, but these animals are given out. As a almost like a peace offering we're going to give you a panda and we're going to be on good terms. You don't attack us we don't attack you. Done.

1:09:45 Well, let you keep it on the weekends. Imagine if World War 3 was stalled because of pandas, all the zoos like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, let's not, let's not get too crazy. We don't this is our biggest attraction right here. It's like okay. Well, you're right. Yeah, I was just a little too much for me to want to include it, sure. But essentially, not only is it a very highly respected animal. They very much use that animal to their advantage. Hmm. Interesting and the penalties for harming them are catastrophic.

1:10:28 Yeah. Hmm, 20 years to life in prison pretty expensive burger, that's an expensive burger. Yeah. Right. And yeah, I would just like to reiterate the fact, by all means. Go ahead and Google. It are all pandas born, female. You will 100% get the answer. Yes. All right. I'm going to do it. Do it right now and it will pop right. Say, Yes, in fact, all pandas are all pandas are Bone, born female? I did this six times, I had multiple people do this. It happens. Google box lies to you people. Hmm. The Google box is lying to you.

1:11:13 It doesn't specify their at all. That that book this guy has written is mostly made up facts six weeks after giant panda Mei Mei, Yang gave birth in Washington, d.c. some so, Indians National Zoo revealed, the gender of the noun, Newborn Cub not with a colored cake or fireworks but with an adorable photo and the result of a genetic test. It's a boy. So yeah. So like I said, they don't they don't but at the very top it says, oh yes. All pandas are born female. This is exactly the point I'm trying to make Google box is lying to us. Google box spreads information just as much as the average idiot does.

1:11:57 Nails are only created if a panda. Seethes a fright, in its first 48 Hours of life. This is why some zoos and play Panda speakers. Is that what that person was in the costume, the panda spooker? That's hilarious. That's the case. We got a boy coming. Ya scared the crap out of that crapped all over itself. Of course, it could be one of the 50 times a day, but it certainly, that's the point. I'm trying to get at those the misinformation, this is clearly not true. I said, it earlier, they don't develop genitalia until three to four months and the only way to find out is through a blood test until then So that's just I really, really, really wanted to point out that Google spreads misinformation just as the just as much as the average 80 it does. Well, it's only the amount of information that's on Google. So if like the top researchers saying, yeah, pandas are born female, until they develop that's not their parts. That's just a guy who made up a fact and put it in a book. Yeah.

1:13:03 But that's what all science is people that make up facts. Fair fair. Good fine. I'll let you have that one. Yeah. I mean they're making it up through research and stuff, but they're putting it in a book and then sometimes it's wrong, you know? Because sometimes I have to go back and say, you know, what, turns out I was wrong, this space is not water, you know, the Earth is actually flat. Oh boy. Kari ready for the next part, then this one's a little shorter. Do it is this mine? Not quite yet. We're getting there. No, I don't want to chill. I want, I want it now. Instant gratification getting there were getting. There is another theory that suggests pandas are actually extremely smart, and are only pretending to be so dumb and clumsy simply just for the spa treatment that comes with it. Now, there was some folklore, than involved pandas stating that they used to be feared and dangerous animals. Not not a creature, you would want to cross paths with. So, what happened?

1:14:12 Why are they suddenly these cute? Lovable clumsy creature creatures? What if they just decided to play us all for Chumps? They purposefully are playing dumb to be pampered and just handed food instead of having to try so hard and fight in. Wild all the time. They just lost all interest in living on their own and somehow got humans to take care of them. 24/7. There's also the suggestion that they want to be, that there's also the suggestion that they want to be extinct, and humans are simply just interfering with the course of nature. It is said that neither male or female pandas have much of a sex drive, so much.

1:14:53 So, to the point where they have to be shown porn in order to get them in the mood, Top that off with the abandonment of Cubs and the potential of the mother killing the cub. Also the poor reproductive system, it all just seems a bit odd. They went from these Fierce strong animals to these lazy. Lazy useless creatures. Seriously, what happened? All of these poor survival skills, could also help aid. The lab made Chimera Theory. Such an animal would have figured out how to survive or would have died out by now, right, fun fact in 2014, a panda faked being pregnant, just so she could get more bamboo.

1:15:37 Ooh, and that's pretty smart if you ask me. That's pretty smart. I just had this like when you said that the porn thing I just had this like the memory of like that Beerfest movie where the guy is like cranking one out on the Frog, on the town, the table. We're just like look, that's a big. So we met up with this stuff all the time, people get all on their feels about animals going extinct. Sometimes it's not for a good reason, right? Like they get hunted to Extinction and stuff like that. In the populations have to be brought back, which seems to be the case for the panda. But also I mean, given that, you know, that one birth at a time and if they have to they kill one because just abandon it, they're like, oh well I don't have the energy and I kind of looked up there like these of them sitting on their cubs and everything too.

1:16:30 So like they are just, I mean, dog girl is creatures, right? Do that like on purpose, but they'll like, roll over on the run or whatever, you know. Just crush it crush the life out of it. But I mean if pandas doing the same thing, I mean I think that for a very long time and places that weren't you know inhabited by people to the extent of we're trying to play God and keep animals and things from Extinction. Things just died out things died out, other things took its place and I personally have the opinion that yeah, they may be cool and stuff, but if this is really the extent that we're going to to keep this population of animals Alive. What's the end?

1:17:13 Because it's not getting any better, right? So just let them be natural and if they die out they die out to me it's more weird to try to put our hands in it and you know project with the future ecosystem is going to be like you know, maybe there's an up-and-coming creature that's going to take the place of the population of pandas in that area. But we are decimating that in order to keep these lazy, you No, whatever. We don't care about even our own reproduction animals alive. You know, it just doesn't make a whole heck of a lot of sense to me. Yeah. Get it. Or maybe I'm just selfish, I don't know. Whatever.

1:17:58 I think they're, I personally have never really been nearly as interested in pandas, is most people are in this world, I guess thought they were another black and white creature that roams the Earth. Mmm. Nothing said I keep in mind, I am a deer hunter and deer hunters, you know, help with, you know, preserving the deer population by taking out the older one. So, the younger ones have a chance to mate and all that sort of stuff and pass on good genes. And that whole program is insane. The way that it's the way that we manage Wildlife Resources and stuff like that, the deer population right now in the United States is higher than it's ever been. Because when When the United States was being colonized deer and all manner of hooved animals were hunted today near Extinction you know the Bison.

1:18:51 Absolutely was right. Dang near Extinction and those numbers have come up and stuff. But what we see in dear and you know other types of hooved animals and stuff and things that we've hunted to Extinction, there's a willingness to Once protected and once preserved there's a willingness to explode, those populations. To, you know, reclaim those areas that were lost because of the dwindling herds and all that sort of stuff, but we're not saying those pandas. So why bother just let him go. You know? Yeah. We had a good run by. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You got anything Jeremy?

1:19:31 Nope, no I this is This isn't really my my forte, my mind is more of lower and everything. I was getting really excited there at the beginning, not saying that this is not excited, this is good stuff and learning a lot here. I just, it definitely goes through stages started. Like I said, I brought a little bit of all of us into this. I started with the Jeremy stuff, I'm good working on the Jeff stuff. I'm coming to the end of that, and then we're just gonna blow it right up with a jake move. Yeah. Now, what will turn it into a Cryptid? It is, if we allow them to die out, but then people keep seeing random little populations.

1:20:11 And then there's hints about the pandas are coming back, that's when it will be a real Cryptid. And then we find out there is one left over, and it's so lazy. It's just, you know, leaned up against it, free pissing all over its own face, you know, bamboo within three feet around its body and then it just dies eventually. Right, hilarious. Absolutely, if you're gonna go out, you better go out hilarious. That's okay. So here's the thing, we're almost done. Two more sections. Hmm, let's do it. Okay, so this is my last Jeff type section. It's Jeff's bedtime, and then and then we're going to let you guys give your final thoughts. And I'm just gonna blow this right out of the water. Okay?

1:21:01 Okay, ready. Yes. Here we go. Another suggestion that I came across was pandas or all robots, or even possibly people in suits. If you look at the way they sit, it seems to be very human. They have the extended wrist with what looks like an axe almost like a thumb. Plus the dexterity of a panda has this very human-like aspect to it. They're just curious and clumsy is all something that humans most definitely are at times as well. The way the humans and pandas act seem very similar at times and it is, and it has made people question, whether the panda is real animal, or just someone in a really fancy suit, one person.

1:21:49 Should one person suggested these people acting as pandas are just very drunk hence, why they're so clumsy and carefree. Baby pandas are just animatronics so they don't have to worry about any Outburst from a real child, The Simpsons even poked fun at this theory, in the episode Homer versus dignity, which aired November of 2000, Homer dresses up as a panda and dances for the crowd. All the teasing aside, this Theory can be led into a bit of a dark Rabbit Hole. There was a suggestion that panda bears are somehow linked to a pedophilic trafficking ring. NG known as Panda eyes? Yes, this is as terrible as it sounds. However, Panda eyes is a whole other conspiracy topic that is very heavy and I could not find relation to the giant panda conspiracy.

1:22:41 But wait, there's more to it. Still did you know that there's a virus that can transmit two pandas and we'll kill them? Apparently, this is a thing, and the reason why people who work clothes closely with pandas, or handle, the pandas are usually dressed up in medical. Including masks gloves, the whole nine yards. I couldn't find anything about a human virus that could possibly kill a panda, but I did find that there. Have been cases of canine distemper virus in pandas the canine distemper virus sometimes referred to as the foot pad disease can affect several bodily functions including the respiratory system, the spinal cord and the brain and was closely related to the measles or mumps in humans. But as far as for a human to Panda, virus. I could find no such thing.

1:23:35 What do you guys think about that? Strange. I would say no to the people in suits. As I was reading that I could hear literally, I was reading that people in suits, I'm like, wow, I've had this argument before. I've we've had this discussion several times. If we can't make a Bigfoot suit, what the hell makes you think we're going to make a panda suit, right? Like that's that's what went through my head. I've had this conversation before. We can't do this. There's no way that that's a person, a drunk person in a suit. I'm sorry. I don't know.

1:24:16 I've been drunk many times. I'm not quiet when I'm drunk. Thank you. So like I can't imagine a drunk. Soon being willing to dress up as a panda falling out of a tree and just not saying a word and getting up and walking away. No, no, it's not happening. Yes, it's ridiculous. Unless they're mutes, yeah, exactly. How deep can this Rabbit Hole go? They're both drunk and they're mutes and they're deaf and they are very clumsy and they sneak away to go get an extra buzz. When No one's looking. That's why. Yeah, that's why people are always around them because they need to feed them more booze to keep them perpetually drunk answers right there. Problem solved.

1:25:05 Yep. What do you think, Jeremy? What's your final thoughts about the panda as of right now? Interesting guy. I don't believe that there is existing nope and it honestly wasn't one of the biggest head. Scratchers today is the camouflage question to me. Yeah, that's a that is Das. Got me going there racking my brain. You know, I mean if they're going up Rocky snow covered Hills or you know, whatever maybe maybe that's the best way is because of the pattern of white and rock colored surfaces from the snow.

1:25:50 But even then that that it's such a weird pattern on those things and they just look goofy, looking Extremely Goofy. And then on top of that, they handstand piss, which is something I'm going to have Colorado. - that's you, that's very funny. You just just see like a an embarrassment of pandas. Handstand pissing all over each other. Like that's embarrassing, dad jokes. Very cool. I, I really appreciated this episode. This was ready for me. You ready for me to pull the Jake and blow this right out of the water, though.

1:26:32 And then, can I say my final thoughts? Yeah, you can have a final thoughts after that to? Okay, cool. Well, I mean, yeah. So, demons for I read this, the entire time I was writing up this Little Portion here. I could not stop thinking about the night crawler. So gross never said that. I'm out guys, here's the thing with this conspiracy. The entire thing was started on Reddit, back in 2014, someone posted a picture of two pandas playing on some school ground equipment and captioned, it quote, I'm fairly certain that. Pandas are just an extremely elaborate hoax and quote from there, the idea took off and people as I mentioned before, clearly didn't do any proper research before dropping all of these so-called facts about pandas today, it has become one of the bigger conspiracy theories to make its rounds on Tick-Tock. The reality is if we can't make a bigfoot costume to look that realistic, there's no way we can make a giant panda suit to make the to look that realistic.

1:27:39 Well, the pandas aren't real. Conspiracy is actually quite on par with the birds aren't real conspiracy, but not nearly as cool. So, with all that being said, here's my final thoughts. I think pandas are as real as can be, despite how clumsy and human-like they may appear. The reality of the topic is, it's nothing more than some misinformation and rumors that have been spreading for almost a decade. Now, they are not allowed made creature. They are not people in a very well-made suit. Nor are they are robots. Ott. There's plenty of history and documentation on pandas, and yeah, they might have their food source a bit backwards but hey, they're happy, right? I genuinely think that people need to learn how to take a step back. Do some real and good research.

1:28:24 It doesn't help that Google is confirming false information either. So with that being said, stop using the Google box. Don't believe everything you read or see on the internet because it might lead you down some crazy yet. Still silly rabbit holes like this one. Here. I hope everyone enjoyed this topic and I know it's a bit of a weird one, but I thought it would be interesting. Interesting to discuss, nonetheless. I had to make sure that people knew the truth about these adorable and clumsy animals. Yeah, I'll admit there's some shady shit, but I can also tell you that the giant pandas are absolutely 100% real. The end adorable. That being said, I don't believe that pandas are no, no, I actually think that there could be, sure, I think that they could be genetic mutations or bread to look that way for royalty reasons or, you know, some sort of prestige reasons.

1:29:30 I mean, I don't think that this is Is too political to say anyone can really look on the news these days and see what China's doing. And the fact that they they hold on to this resource of the pandas, which are only native to China, and they hold onto some so closely that they rent them out to two places. And the stipulation is at any point we could say, all right now, give them back. It just kind of goes hand-in-hand with the way that the government of China controls. Everything else. Inside a China. So that really isn't, you know, thinking about it more. It's not really that unique or that mysterious rather, it's like, okay. Well I mean, it makes total sense comparing where they come from and the way that that is all these are being handled over there.

1:30:18 Rising between that was. Yeah, that's right. But it was like, but I don't know, maybe, yeah. Maybe they were created to be some sort of prestigious type thing, you know, I mean, who knows? But it's, I don't think that you'd have to go far to find conspiracies for dang near everything that exists, you know, in the animal kingdom in, you know, politically or whatever. Right. I think that we could probably do a topic like this and a deep dive like this on, you know, anything?

1:30:59 I know that like there's a really big Beer see that here in North America the Black Panther exists, right? But it's more along the lines of like a black mountain lion. Even though there has never, once been a mountain lion that has been born. That looked any different from any other mountain lion that's ever been born. At least observed. Right. That's not to say it couldn't happen, but it's highly improbable. But yet people still He'll claim that they've seen black mountain lions and there's a huge population in southern states that believe that there's a black panther not saying not, not talking about the ones that come from like Mexico and stuff, right?

1:31:43 But like a native Black Panther and that's, you know, could be cryptozoology, could be huge conspiracy, that sort of stuff, but it's just like, you know? It's I mean, it's interesting. It's interesting getting into what people think about the sort of stuff. And I think if you, if you tie in the History of, you know, a foreign nation that, you know, we I barely know what our own government and you know, people are doing across the country. You know, I have no idea, you know, really with it out, you know, it being broadcasted what China's doing. So you could add a mysterious factor into it with this animal. That's very exclusive to that region and then the way they hold that resource so closely.

1:32:30 I mean, it makes sense. So that they, you know, I don't know why we wouldn't do that. Be like, whatever our natural animal is that's different from everywhere else versus what happened in the, you know, thirteen to Seventeen hundreds, which was, hey, there's no pigs on this island in Hawaii. Let's bring it pigs, you know? Or just like, we're all this sort of stuff or oh, gosh, there's no carp over here and, you know, the western United States, let's throw carp and every single River and Stream. So it destroys the Natural fish populations that are in there, you know, it's just like we just take all these animals and throw them out all over the place versus a country that's using the animal that's native to them and saying you know, let's make some money off this thing especially if they're so dumb and lazy that they probably won't be around for very much longer without extreme human intervention. Let's make a bunch of money off of this thing, you know, a million dollars, a pop and just telling me like this is a loner, this isn't for you.

1:33:31 This is you know this is ours. Yeah. You know I think you know it's somewhat messed up but also somewhat pretty intelligent to do something like that. Yeah. Yeah, I don't know, I don't, I'm not buying into any of the conspiracies, besides the one that, you know, it could have been just made by people but you know not in any sort of lab sort of experiment, type thing, you know, it doesn't take a laboratory to breed a specific type of, you know, dog or a specific type of whatever. You know, if you want to make a liger, you don't have to join the embryo in the air or the embryo.

1:34:13 The sperm together for the egg and the sperm together in a test tube. I'm sure you could or people do, but if you could get them to just mate with each other, you know, you could just do that, but I don't know. I think it's interesting, regardless, Yeah. That's why I did it. Yeah I thought it was a lot of fun and it was like I said it kind of veered off of the normal path that we do a little bit. So kid you did a great job. Yeah. Yeah. You had you had a lot of different aspects in there and on top of that I think people that are listening to this or going to get a really good chunk of knowledge when it comes to the history and mythology of pandas and I think that's where I learned a lot about pandas do other the locker.

1:34:59 So I learned a lot just Listening to you today. Yeah. No nothing coming into this. I even know if pandas were real. I've never seen one there you go. Now you got your answer apparently they're real? Well, yeah, I've never seen one of their life but true. Yeah, me neither. Oh, I even wish I knew goes do and I didn't see one. I have no, I had it. That was him in pictures and videos he's ever seen. I've seen red paint little red. Pandas are so cute. Those things. Okay, they're they're cute. They're adorable. For just those are Atkins. My favorite thing is when they get all huffy and they stand up on their hind legs and like they come on, pretty awesome that you wanted a red panda as a pet. I'd be like, yeah, I mean obviously well I was one of those too but I want a possum first, I mean, I can. Okay, Why don't know what animal. I truly truly would love to have as a pet. Hmm.

1:36:12 A tortoise, not a sugar glider. Not. So, that's what Katie wants. Katie want to show you. I want a tortoise. I like turtles. Send you a snapping turtle will call it a car. You like turtles ice. I had a turtle long, long time ago. his name was shaky disclaimer, we are not actually shipping animals, as far as I know that's illegal, but That's pandas very good kid. Thank you. Very, very cool. I have next time brown bears. Do they exist? Are they aliens?

1:36:53 Are they here for our butts? Find out? Next time on infant Rabbit Hole. Oh my God, the answer to all the above is. Yes. Yep Millions they're definitely here for our butts. Yep aliens love but stuff alien bear love but stuff. If he's man their sake, half man. Half, bear and half pig. Seen a shaved Beer Baron, tell me it's not a fucking alien out for your butthole. Oh, go ahead. Tell me, good goodness. Now I well, kid through your clothes out house. No, you go for it. Me, you told me that you told me, that was your job. So, awful hole and do your job.

1:37:40 I don't think so lazy. Yeah. That'll be your exact words were. I always do the closing I'm because nobody wants to do it. Everyone scared. I didn't write one up this time because you don't have the right. So, Adam anyone about it. I want to write it up. Anyways that was another a rabbit hole podcast. Thank you for stopping by, we'll see you next week. Next bath of the infant Rabbit Hole. Bye everybody. Bye-bye.