167. Tim Binnall Interview & Aliens, Bigfoot, and Ghosts

0:01 Welcome back to the Infinite Rabbit Hole. I'm your host, Jeremy, and today we've got special guests in the house. First, let's go ahead and introduce Jake. What's up, man? How you doing? Doing all right? How are you? I'm doing OK. That's all I'm going to do, right, man? I'm going to go ahead and jump right in. It is my honor to introduce our guest for the night, the host of the Banal of America podcast, right? It's not a podcast. It's a podcast, so it's always, yeah, it's a podcast. Tim Benall, everybody. What's going on? Hey, hey. How you doing Jake? Jeremy, good to good to be on here. Right on here.

0:43 Yeah, appreciate you coming in. So, Tim. Yes. For all of our listeners who may not know who you are right real quick. Like I said, host of the Banal of America podcast, and you're also an editor for the Coast to Coast AM website. News editor, Yes, yeah. News editor. How did you get that? Well, my origin story's kind of long, but I'll give you the the basic rundown. I graduated from Syracuse in 2001. And where are you guys based on it, by the way? From Wisconsin, but I grew up in Connecticut.

1:23 Oh, OK, Jake. Yeah, from we're down here in Menominee, Wisconsin, but I'm from Northern California originally. Oh, nice, nice. So graduated from Syracuse in 2001 and essentially wound up needing a job. So I took, I say TV and film, and I was planning on going off to California TV, radio and film. But first I hung around in my town and got a job on the overnight as a janitor at my old high school 'cause I just needed to make some money and then wound up really getting. I had an interest in the paranormal growing up, but then I kind of lost it just when I went to school and everything and got out of school and was working on the overnight. This is like 2003 by now is when this all kind of came together and got really into the paranormal. So I was like, oh, you should be listening to Art Bell. And I'm like, what the hell is that? Then I was like, oh, wow.

2:23 So I got started listening to Coast to coast, spent a couple years just listening to Coast to Coast, just absorbing it. Like I like to say that was like my, my undergrad pretty much was just spent like several years just listening to Coast to Coast. So finally about 2005, I was like, I really want to ask some questions to these people, but I can't really do it on my overnight job. So I'm going to start, I'm going to interview them. Essentially. I'm like, well, I can interview them. I'm a big wrestling fan. So I was subscribing to a wrestling website at the time and they had like news updates. You would download them in these files called MP Threes. It's like new 2005.

3:07 So I was like, oh, I know what I'm going to do. I'm going to get a, a little splicer from RadioShack and a digital recorder and record my phone calls with these people, these, these paranormal experts essentially. And that that launched Ben All of America Audio 'cause there wasn't any podcast hadn't come along yet. So there was no such thing as a podcast yet. So, so the show was just called Ben All of America Audio. We've dropped, we've dropped the audio over the years eventually, but so that was it. And then so as I was interviewing these people and stuff, it was friendly with the folks at Coast to Coast. They brought me in to do fill in website work for them. Then around 2000 and November 2015, so about 10 years into my podcasting career, they were like, they wanted to expand to daytime content by by way of news articles. So they brought me in as their news editor. And essentially I've been doing that now for almost 10 years where I write, let's say 90% of the articles if you go to the Coast to Coast AM website drop down articles as bylines for all my stuff.

4:14 But yeah, I read about 13 pieces a week for Coast to Coast covering everything that's happening in the world of the weird and the wondrous five days a week, Monday through Friday. So it's, it's a full time job. Yeah, I, I'm probably one of the hardest working people in the paranormal. Not to pat myself too much on the back, but it's like I do that five days a week. Plus the podcast, you know, and I got to stay on top of everything happened in the world of paranormal all day, all the time, all the topics. So it's, it's a pretty, yeah, it's exhausting, but it's it's a pretty cool place to be spot to be in. Absolutely I I know the listeners of the Infinite Rabbit Hole are are definitely familiar with the Coast to Coast AM article because I share your stuff all the time.

5:00 No thanks man. Thanks. Yeah, I, I've been recently doing a lot more on, on the Facebook page, the Twitter and and whatnot or X whatever it's called now. But I'm always sharing your stuff and I I do appreciate all the hard work you put in there because you got some great shit. Oh, thanks, man. Yeah, I take a lot of pride and find it like the really, really obscure international stuff. I think like last week we had stuff from like I want we had 13 accolade. I want to say there's probably a dozen different countries in there in the different articles. It was crazy. I was really like, I finished the week and I was like, holy shit. It was like Peru, Chile, you know, Japan, Mexico, Canada. It was like every country, like Britain. It was just crazy, crazy, crazy mixing different countries. So I was like, wow, this really, this is a really international week here.

5:50 And that's happening more often than not nowadays, because I've kind of got a real handle for digging up these odd stories from odd corners of the world. Hell yeah, man. And then just the, the cherry on top is, I mean, you got you're, you're now over well over 1000 episodes of Banal of America. You've been around for a long time. Yeah, well, I've been doing the show. Well, we took a hiatus sort of like, I want to say 2018 until really like last fall. But I started in 2005 doing Banal of America and then was I said we ran for in chunks called like seasons. So 33 episodes of seasons.

6:31 We did that for 10 seasons, which stretched out over 10 years because after a while I started to take longer time between shows, time between seasons. It just kind of became like this is, you know, really tiring. And then by the time I got the full time gig with Coast to Coast, it was really difficult to do both at once. So it was kind of like I'm going to wrap up the show with season 10. So we did a big send off. Then I came back for a few holiday shows, tried to reboot the show. Well, then the pandemic hit. So I did like a ten week spin off kind of pandemic podcast during the pandemic. Then people were like they were kind of pandemic. This was like right when the pandemic started. So it was like, let's let's do everyone's home. You know, I'm like, I'm interested in this story. It's like all anyone's talking about. So let's do a let's do a pandemic podcast like and that ran for 10 weeks and people were like, OK, by the time that was done, I think we finished up Memorial Day 2020 that weekend and it was like, all right, people want, they want to hear me get back into paranormal.

7:37 So we did a summer of strangeness. That was like 10 shows planned to do a winter of weirdness. And then things just the wheels just kind of fell off because I've been using, really using the same method that I had back in 2005, which was through the phone, through blog talk, I think was. Yeah, But through blog talk, which is how we were doing the shows. And it was just, it was just really like running on, you know, paper clips and duct tape. It was just like, really we tried to bring it back like in the spring of like 21, I think, or 22. And it was just like the whole lot, like every episode was plagued 22. Yeah. And every episode was just like kind of plagued by these different tactical problems.

8:19 And I'm just like, you know, this isn't fun for me because it's too distracting trying to do the show with all these problems of things sound like shit or the guests are calling in on Skype and I'm on a regular phone and blog talk is like, it just can't like put all this together. So finally the urging of Steve Berg. I don't know if you guys know Steve Berg, but he's an actor, comedian and also a paranormal, now a paranormal podcaster. He was like, we're really good friends and he was like, he was a huge been all, I guess he still is a huge been all of America fan. And he was like, you gotta you gotta you gotta bring the show back. So finally when he launched his show, I was like, look, all right, how the fuck? Like, if you just can launch this from scratch, it must be easier than I thought.

9:05 And he was kind of was like, I use this site, I do it this way, I get the mic, you know. And so pretty much was like, all right, we're ready to go. And we relaunched the show in October. And I think we're up to like 30 or so episodes, you know, been doing every week since the very, you know, live last weekend in October. So it's been, you know, seven or eight months now. It's been great. It's been really fun to be back. So, yeah, I don't know if it's over 1000 because of the break, but it's certainly 500 shows probably at this point. I mean, certainly almost 20 years worth of shows. So it's probably easier to do it that way. So yeah, almost 20 years worth of with the shows metric. Jeremy pretty much hit me up about scoring an interview with you and he, he kind of showed me your, I don't know, like a descriptor page on coast to Coast.

9:55 And I was like, I was like, he's like, oh, you want to be on this episode? I was like, you know, I'm not the paranormal guy dude. I'm the crypted guy. And he's just like, Nah, just kind of just listen to some of his stuff. And so today I, I literally listened to your show, the, the revival for 10 hours straight. And I'm, I mean, I, I work on airplanes and they're all in the hangar Bay. And I was, I was setting up a system not even part of my, my job really, but we just kind of have busy work. So I threw my earbud in. I was just listening to all your stuff. I sent him a screenshot of the Paige daily episode because we had a Loch Ness Monster thing maybe a year or so ago where we were just crapped all over it, talked about how fake it was. And I really liked her response and your, your thing. We were like, well, what is it? And she's like, it's the Loch Ness Monster, you know, I've never seen anything.

10:41 And I was like, man, we gotta get this. We gotta get this lady on the show. So I sent him this. So we're gonna be griefing all your, all your guests and stuff. But yeah, I was like, I, I shot him a, a message on messenger and I was like, dude, this guy's like the Joe Rogan, except really weird topics. I was like, I really like it. Now. I haven't, I haven't listened to you long enough to find out what your, your catch phrase is for Rogan. It's DMT and whoa, I, I don't know you know for you yet. But I got a few I've got I got a probably right, right, right. I use that a lot like some would say. So just to agree with them, I'll just be like, yeah, right, right, right. I got it. I got that kind of thing. But. Yeah, I'm, I'm really digging it. I like. Thanks man, just dig into the archive. You're going to like this tons of shit in there. If you like more cryptids and weird shit like that, you'll you know, that's kind of always been my I love cryptozoology, but that was my whole point of doing the show is to like do is wide a berth as possible of topics.

11:38 So it's like by the time I fit, but now where I'm at now, it's like we've covered just about every story and topic you can think of in the paranormal. Like, you know, kind of not so much conspiracy wrong, but some conspiracies like moon hoax and death hoaxes I like to do. Like weird. Flatter anything that's like a wacky kind of conspiracy theory I like to do and I'm not like doing Q Anon and shit, but but yeah, but I always wanted to be like encyclopedic in a sense where Someone Like You, Jake, who just found the show. Now you can go back and be like, all right, well, what, you know, what is the I, we just, we do, we post our classic shows on YouTube and like we just a couple of days ago, we just put on like a three hour Bermuda Triangle episode and it's like we got a probably about two, two hour plus episode on spontaneous human combustion. You know, so it was kind of like over the years it was going on. I'm like, well, what haven't we done yet? It's like Amelia Earhart, you gotta do Amelia Earhart, you gotta do I think maybe you haven't done crop circles. That might be the only one I haven't really done a whole show on, which is I should like write that. I'll, I'll remember it, but I that'll be one I should do soonish crop circle episode.

12:52 But yeah, that's, that's kind of the whole deal. So yeah, for anyone who's just discovering been all of America, now you're in for a treat 'cause it's like you can go back and check out these old shows that are that are chock full of all every different topic you can possibly think of. Nice for sure I was. Threatening Jeremy earlier because he, I was talking about you and he's like, oh, well, you're going to get to hear him and I'll or talk to him tonight. And I was like, I was like, wait, just me. Are you going to bail on me? I was like, I was like, I swear to bail on me. This is going to be the first Infinite Rabbit Hole episode focused entirely on the DMV. Oh well, hell, man, we might be able to fill in one of those holes. We just landed a sweet gig with Elmwood, the city of Elmwood in Wisconsin, to do a documentary and stuff for him. Oh, wow, awesome.

13:42 Pretty cool stuff there. Speaking of your catalog, though, 22 episodes really stuck out to me. The one that I led to listen to today, I had to listen to Lauren Coleman. I actually reached out to him and he told me he didn't do podcasts and I was like, Oh well, OK. And and then you did our our good friend Asher's. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I actually am a Co host on her Beast and Beyond podcast that she runs through the on Wednesdays we talk we're Rs feed. Yes, OK, yeah, we talked about that when she was on the show. The beat the beasts. The beasts like the spin offs that she's doing. Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

14:23 Yeah, She, she tagged along with our injured cold coverage. And I think that's what really did our podcast really well was was that series. So we, we, we, we love Astra's here in the Yeah, she's real. Cool. But Jake, any more questions, 'cause I got, I got, I got a banger. Now go for it. Cool. All right, Tim, so I'm I'm sure you heard the news. They're they're bringing back the Las Vegas alien videos. What do you think? Yeah, I've seen that. I saw that. Yeah. I'm not really too impressed.

15:04 This it kind of it it, you know, all this stuff always sort of falls apart. So I'm waiting to see kind of like I think the guy who analyzed it says he'll put it off for peer review or whatever. So it's like, well, and maybe if somebody else looks at it, I might give it a more serious look. But to me, it's, yeah, I, I, it's, it's just weird that it's kind of come back all of a sudden after almost a year. Yeah, that's what I was talking to somebody today about that. And they're like, well, what? What are they trying to distract us from? And it's like, yeah, I don't know, there's a 10 foot alien with cloaking on, you know, Like, you know, it's got to be something because it just came out of nowhere over a year later. Yeah, yeah, it's, well, I mean, I think part of it is like, I mean, we won't really know until more time goes by. But I think that report from Arrow, AARO in January or February where they were like here it is, we didn't find anything.

16:04 It seemed to really take, it felt like it really took the wind out of the sails of the UFO subject, especially like the Super pro, you know, disclosure people, I call them UAP aficionados because that's, you know, that's what they want their thing to be. So, so and it differentiates it from what I prefer, which is like old school Ufology and flying saucers, Stan Friedman, the old timers who were kind of like a little more eccentrics. Now it's like government people and sort of a little more highfalutin characters that are sort of driving this UFO thing. So it feels like a lot of the air went out of the balloon with that because I just don't feel the same buzz about UFOs that I did even like a year or two ago.

16:48 So yeah, they're, they're in their death throes, though they're still trying. They're bringing Congress in all the time. They're they're really trying to kick start this. Yeah, yeah. It's definitely made it into a serious issue. And definitely Congress has involved sort of, you know, there's some congressmen who are really into it. So it's it's certainly being taken more seriously than it ever has in my career looking at it. So it's interesting. I don't necessarily believe the government's going to say that it's aliens. So it's kind of, you know, to me, it's just kind of like, I think it's going to end up just kind of reaching a standstill. I mean, I don't it just, yeah, I don't really, I don't really buy it. The government's going to tell us. And I certainly like whether like, oh, well, you got to release all the UFO documents.

17:40 Like they're not going to find like one document that's like, oh, whoops. We we forgot that there was a picture of a dead alien in this file that we were forced to release. It's like they got, if they know, if they have information and shit, the government like they got it all locked down, dude. They're not, it's not like something that they that you can accidentally get or force them to release. They'll just be like, yeah, no, that part's not that part. That's not, you know, it's that's filed under FUO. So it's they don't you know you? Don't get to see it. There's that, and then there's also the the contracting portion of it. You submit a FOIA request to the US government and they're like, well, that's owned by Lockheed, right? Exactly.

18:21 You're not going to get nothing. Yeah. Yeah, we've all compartmentalize and shit, if it's even, you know, if we even have anything that's like, I don't even necessarily believe, like the government knows what the fucks going on a lot of the time, most of the time, especially with UFOs. So it's like they may be as confused as we are and they just don't want to tell anybody that they don't really know what the deal is. That's probably the case if if I had to put my money in anything, it's that they don't know shit. Yeah, I mean, look, it would be fucking awesome. Like the old story of like Eisenhower meet an alien at the at the air at the air base and like they cut a deal, even though it's a horrible deal, like the aliens could abduct us and shit.

19:01 It's like, that's a that's a great story. I'd be like fucking in a way at once. It would be awesome if it was true. It'd be like, wow, that's fucking crazy. The government was cutting secret deals with the aliens like in the 40s. But the other part is just like, I don't know, it's been so long that part of me is like this, this ought to have been cracked open by now if it if it was what they say it is and what we think it is. You know what I mean? Like that it's aliens that are coming from another planet. Like, you know, I part of me just thinks, I think I think we can kind of get to the bottom of this by now. There's been a lot of people working on it. It's not like this is some new thing. This is like the generations of people have been trying to figure this out.

19:42 So it's like, oh, maybe they all, a lot of them seem to be working backwards from the answer is that these are aliens coming here. So it's like, oh, maybe if you, if we reverse the course of what we're looking at, we'll get a better handle on this because maybe it's not aliens. Because I've always recently came to my attention just the science of it, where it's like. If you, Jake or Jeremy, if you guys went to like Mars or whatever and got out of your little ship like you would like be crushed or whatever, like by the gravity or you'll be all fucked up. Like you just, you know, So to me it's like, if anything, it's like these beings or whatever, it's like they're probably fucking robots or something. How else could they function in our gravity and? Everything.

20:31 Like they're like. BLOB fish at the desk of the ocean. They're fish, but you bring them up, feed up bubblegum, Yeah. Well, we, we brought that up multiple times how if anything, these things have to be drones, some some sort of manufacturer organic drone. Or you ask Jeff and he says that you know, extraterrestrial extraterra on the other side of the ice wall. Type they're. From here, they're from the hollow earth type stuff, you know. Yeah. Yeah, oh, that's a point. Yeah, I know I've heard that theory that like, yeah, they exist within the Earth. So it's like, okay, well, that's a whole different. That's a whole now then why the fuck would the government ever tell us that, dude?

21:13 Like they're not, they're definitely not going to tell us. Oh, it turns out there's a whole civilization living under the planet and it's like we can't even get along here in America, like much less with anyone else on the planet. Like all there's all these wars going on now. It's like we found that now we. Found a new civilization under the ice and we're going to start a nuclear Holocaust with them. Right, right. We found out there's a whole other civilization. They live secretly on the earth. They're more advanced than us. It's like, yeah, that that won't fucking freak people out. You know, I think the best case scenario is they go look, we found some shit on Mars, we found some monuments. There's no one there.

21:55 We can't find anybody else, but there's some monuments. So clearly, you know, intelligent beings exist out in the universe. They were around here at some point. Maybe they created us. We don't know. We don't know anything about them. All we know is they existed and they're gone. So you don't have to worry about them coming to hurt you or anything like that. They're not just couldn't be any invasion because they're all gone. They must have died in some kind of disaster. And you know, we need be better to each other here on Earth to prevent that from happening here. That would be like the best thing that could happen. I think that would be like the most the safest because I liken this the pandemic was disclosure. That was the alien, that was the template, the pandemic. So it's like this outer force came. We don't know what the deal is with this outside force. It fucks you up and, and no one could. You would think the whole idea was like, oh, the aliens would come and we'd all work together to fucking band off the alien. And it's like, no, that didn't happen, dude. The alien came and we fought each other over how to how to deal with the alien.

23:02 Like we, we, we self destructed. We self destructed in the face of the alien. We were like, fuck you. Well, what you got to do with the alien is you got to do this. You're lying. You know what you're talking about, like whatever. And it's like there's your there's your template for disclosure. That's like, why, why they why? I'm actually an almost an anti disclosure advocate simply by that notion that it's like we can't fucking handle this dude. We cannot. We cannot handle the truth. I don't care what anyone says, like you and I3 of us. Sure, we've thought about this. We've contemplated this regular people who get their news from the news and don't think beyond that or don't even watch the news. I know people that don't even fucking watch the news. Like how do you like who have no connection to current events? Like they watch sports or TV shows and shit. But like, if you're like, well, what do you think? There's a big trial going on here in Massachusetts. Karen Reed trial.

23:57 I'm like a huge true crime buff, you know, ask for. I don't know who that is. Like, what do you mean? And I'm like, well, what do you think how the election's shaping up 'cause it's, you know, it's going to be this real. I, oh, is that what's happening? Is it going to be those two again? It's like, how do you not know this shit? So there's tons of people. Like this out there, tons and tons of people. I'd say more than more than half, like the majority of people are probably kind of just tuned fucking out. On the alien topic, I'm curious what you thought about those fossilized. Like was it Peruvian or Mexican aliens that came out earlier? This. Year. Yeah, those are fake because people were like people. Were like, oh, but yeah, I mean, and also it's like why? Why would their heads be supporting their bodies and their backs up that you die and your head goes down like this if you're laying on a flat surface you moron. Yeah, yeah, the I did an article about it. Like, around the start of the year, the Peruvian government seized a couple other ones last fall and then did tests on them and pretty much conclusively showed that they were like cobbled together, like animal bones. I think like dolls.

25:08 They were dolls that were like had some looked. Like the worst gamer mache ever was used. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But they're like, pissed about it. The Peruvian government and everything. They're like, stop. Like, you know, it in some cases, well, they don't know about the other ones necessarily, but like the thing they show that they see is the airport looks exactly like the one for Mexico. So it's like, OK, dude, this is probably like the same guy, the same. Well, whoever made the doll, like it's the same dude. Otherwise, it's uncanny the resemblance. So they're just kind of like, hey, you're encouraging people to come to our country and take shit essentially. So stop doing that. That's kind of.

25:50 Their. Their deal? Yeah, so, well, I mean, I'm just thinking about like if that whole thing was a dry run for an an abduction, we're completely fucked. We're so fucked. What do you mean? We're talking about the the COVID years. Yeah, yeah, we're fucked. Like 'cause he was talking. About yeah, people would turn on each other and shit. It would just be like panic, you know, which is what it was like because like with the alien coming in, you know, you don't like at least with people kind of stuck at home so they couldn't really fucking fight each other and shit. It's like if it's like, no, no, you got to like, you know, there's aliens and shit.

26:32 Yeah, it would be. It would be ugly. Could you imagine that, that press conference, it's like, hey, so here's Dave. He's an alien, and he's actually from a different dimension. Watch as he phases into existence. He comes into existence and you just see everybody, you know, 70% of the population, their brains are just going to melt through their fucking ears. I don't know man, I think nearly all of the South would be like but what does Dave taste like? Deep fried. Oh yeah, it would. I've seen it before. I would if it was. It was done in a humane fashion. I would eat an alien. Why not? Oh yeah, you got it. You got to try it if you can't. Especially if there are like some squid monsters or something like that and calamari all day are.

27:13 Are there tags for Dave? Good stuff. So what what did you think about the the Miami Mall stuff? I thought that was all bullshit, too. A lot of this big stuff that kind of gets big, big, big is like, turns out to be garbage. Yeah, it was interesting how it spread. I thought that was really interesting and just sort of like how you can't really these things take on a life of their own pretty much. And it's just spreads like wildfire and Tik Tok's like the bang of my existence. And it's like if shit gets going on TikTok, it like spreads like crazy and it's often most of the information. I mean, I can't say that for sure because I'm not on TikTok, but it sure seems like a lot of the information on TikTok is like bullshit or.

28:07 That's for clicks. Yeah, like that's for kids. Yeah. Oh, and for kids and for kids. So it's like young people like who are like I just found out about like for example, like when you guys, you say you did like the injured cold episode. Like someone could be like they do 30 a 30 second version of the fucking story. And it's like, I just heard the craziest story about this injured cold guy and like fucks up half the details or leaves a whole bunch of stuff out and everything. And then that goes all, you know, it spreads like crazy TikTok and it's like, Christ, like this. And that, that's how you get a whole bunch of people thinking he's like a crazy grinning man that's going to watch you sleep. And it's like, did you listen at all?

28:49 You know? Yeah, no idea exactly. Fucking stupid. It's like yes, but also no. Right, right. No, we we did an episode when that came out and we're still waiting on the trailer for Stranger Things. I think we're going to see something there. You think it's connected to the Stranger Things or you're making a joke. We're like, we're like, it's such a big thing. You know, it's like, I lived in Southern California on on military orders and there would be whole streets blocked off and all these like rice burner race cars sitting on the side of the road because they're doing a movie shoot. They didn't tell anybody about it type stuff. It's like, why don't they why don't, why aren't they filming a, a trailer for some movie or something like that or some movie shoot And all these people in their apartment complexes are are, you know, above it are just like, Oh my gosh, you know.

29:34 Right, Well, that's the other part of it though, too, right? Isn't the only thing really is there's like one essentially like one video, right? I mean, there weren't like tons of videos. Like if something happened at a mall, you would think, like you would think it would be like 50 or 60 videos, you know? I mean, like, you see that when crazy shit happens on when real crazy shit happens, like it's not so great anymore on X 'cause you can't fucking believe half the shit you see on there now, 'cause the moderation's atrocious. But back in the day, like something would happen and you would see like four or five videos pop up of the same thing from different people who were there. I don't mean paranormal per SE. Generally like shootings and shit and like that, you know, like, they'd be like this cop attack this guy.

30:18 Here's, you know, a person filmed it from there and another person was filming it over here and it's like, oh shit. So you know. Yeah, yeah, still I, I don't know just the the line of cars. I I think it was our Co host Jeff that brought it up that, you know, could be potential like a screen shoot for or a scene shoot for some fucking show it. Very well could be, could be. I mean, 'cause I got part of the, I guess the part that I don't necessarily believe is like this part where the people were like, yeah, we were in the mall and these aliens fucking were like, well, like right there. It's like, so, so there's like a dozen people there and an alien like walks through the mall and nobody thought to fucking even film it or take a picture of it. It's like all you have is that video of the, of the huge line of cars.

31:03 And that does look really fucked. But then it could be, but, but part of me, it could be a movie shooting. It also just could be like, I thought the theory was like they thought there was a shooting or something and it was just like, they're so hair triggered with that stuff. Rightfully so with that stuff now that it's like if they thought there was an active shooter at the fucking mall, that is what you would see. You would see a shit load of you know, and and maybe they maybe like somehow they thought that, but they didn't it didn't get out to the wider public at the time where they were like, look, this is just get everybody get the fuck over the mall. Something happened and not fucking aliens or whatever. They all fucking swarmed, swarmed them all.

31:44 But it's that's just kind of thing where there's so many witnesses. There should be better proof than whatever we saw. So clearly it was like some someone took something and kind of was like spun it like and was like it was an alien. Dude, look at this like a baby, Like you were saying, like you were saying Jeremy, like they filmed it out of their apartment window and they were like they made-up the fucking story. Keep you know, then that guy. I don't even I mean, I don't even know who originally filmed that first part. So it's like I don't. Think he ever came forward? It's the one. Guy the 1st. Hand memo that they were shooting a movie. And all the first hand accounts and they're all saying, oh, this is what we saw, this what we saw. It all is parallel to the narrative. And then, and then a couple of days later, they're like, I was just lying, you know, just for, just for the attention. And everyone's like.

32:28 The government's making them say. That and it's just like. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. You know, maybe they're getting too many follow up questions and they're just like, OK, you got me, you know, right, right. Right, exactly. Good stuff, good stuff. So switch the subjects a little bit. Let's go back to the show. How did you get into all this? What? What's your origin with the the strange and the unusual? I just really liked it as a kid, like Unsolved Mysteries, especially like in the 80s and a little bit of sightings in the 90s, but then then kind of just drifted out of it because really there wasn't. I graduated from high school in 97, so right before The X-Files kind of took off.

33:13 So it was kind of like, and you know, when you're in high school, you kind of, you know, I was only interested in really having a good time. So it's like I didn't really care chasing the mysteries of the universe. I was trying to chase other things. So it was like the, you know, I got out of it kind of like in my early teen years or whatever. And then like I said, I got out of college. 911 happened. I I kind of had a renewed interest in Bigfoot. I want to write a Bigfoot movie. It's like back when there weren't fucking 1000 Bigfoot movies. And so I got that. Then I got Lauren Coleman's book, read that, read a few other Bigfoot books and then really kind of like got me into the scene. The whole kicked it all off was Jim Marrs rule by secrecy, which I picked up and read like in one weekend. And then I I read alien agenda, his second book and those two kind of like just I just took off after that. That was kind of like what really launched me into all this.

34:21 I then I started getting everything I could get my hands on. I'm guessing that's the Lauren Coleman book. Yeah. Yeah, it's such, such a good book. Fucking good book you're in. It's a. Great book. Yeah. Yeah, I know Lauren real well. Yeah, he's a good dude. So. I've known Lauren for like 15 years. It's crazy now. Speaking of Bigfoot in New England, actually I saw, I saw mine in southern Vermont. You saw Bigfoot right outside Brattleboro. Really. Yep. Wow. All right. How far is that from Whitehall? I want to say Whitehall. I don't know. I'm not familiar with where Whitehall is.

35:02 I don't think it was the beast. I mean it, it could have been part of the, you know, no, I. Just wonder it would be like the same kind of terrain area. But yeah, wow, that's cool. So you wow Bigfoot siding. You're a very lucky man. Yeah, that's kind of what kicked it off for me. I can imagine. Yeah, I got called a fucking loser in my whole life because I, you know, and then I stopped saying what I saw and just kind of went along with, with life. How old were you when you saw the Bigfoot? Nine years old, man. Oh shit. Wow. And what was it doing? I'm sure you've told the story a million times on the show or in other places, but what? What? Tell again for the 15th. Yeah, tell again for me, You know, you can't say you saw a fucking Bigfoot. Just like, leave, leave me. Yeah, you know, leave me like, OK, man. Yeah.

35:48 Right in your right in your neighborhood there. Well, I'm not going to go into the whole thing. I'll just tell you the gist. What it was doing was it was walking off into the tree line of of a field with a deer over its shoulder. Yeah. And it and the deer was screaming, man. And it just took that fucking thing's head and just smacked it up against the fucking tree. Wow, that's a very detailed and colorful siding. That's a good, that's a great sighting. That's like that's a little doubt that that's a Bigfoot kind of sighting. Very interesting. Yeah, I was. Well, at nine years old, I thought I was a werewolf. That's the only thing I knew. Yeah, I didn't know it was a fucking. I didn't know what a Bigfoot was at nine years old, man. That's.

36:28 A That's a great point. Then that's a yeah, that's, that's a good, yeah, that adds some level of credence to the story. Yeah, 'cause you weren't like, oh, I saw a big yeah. Interesting. That's really interesting. Yeah, man, I I just, I remember, I may or. May not whole story. I may or may not have pissed myself that day. I would have pissed my pants. Yeah. I mean, you must have run away like screaming and shit, right? I mean, I do that now. Yeah, you know that. I I man. How far away was it from you? Probably about 6080 yards. All right, Yeah, well, even far enough away that it wasn't like. Yeah, but still, I'd be fucking scared. Yeah.

37:14 Jesus by. Yourself. Yeah. All by myself. Yeah. No, the story was that I got a new scope for my BB gun and I was being a boy and I wanted to go shoot chipmunks and birds. And I went down to this field that my. Here it goes. I went down to this field and my grandfather used to mow down because it was, you know, his property. And I'm putting out a little bit more information than I guess they've ever heard. But anyways, and he hadn't mowed it down yet. It was in the springtime. And I went down there, I was going to throw sticks out into the field to try to get some quail to, to pop up and try to peg a quail. And I saw this whitetail sitting out in the, the middle of the field. And so I, I put my scope on her ass.

37:56 I was going to shoot her in the butt and then she was gone. So I dropped my gun and there it was, just walking off with this fucking thing in his arm. Jesus. There's no way that it didn't know I was there. I mean, I was a nine year old boy. I didn't. I wasn't being fucking quiet, you know, I'm surprised I didn't scare the fucking the deer away, you know? Yeah, I don't. I don't want to do that shit again. I tell Jake all the time. I said I'll I'll get another fucking sighting, but I want to be in a car or something. I don't. Want to like? Like my sighting when I was driving through Oklahoma, barring a a 7 1/2 foot tall Olympic athlete wearing a ghillie suit running full tilt through a field.

38:42 You know, I was I was telling him I had to drive from from California, Wisconsin. I got out of the Navy and my wife was already in Wisconsin. She had moved a couple months before me and I was put motorcycles in the trailer was driving them across country. I was going through Oklahoma and you know, 8 hours of driving, you're just like scanning around everything and stuff like that, right? Just same semi trucks and me on the freeway all the way across. And I like, I'm glancing into these fields where all these cows are just looking to my right and I see this thing just hauling across this freaking field. And I'm like, I'm like in a, in a 10 second span, I get a good few glances, 'cause there's trucks in front of me.

39:25 They're trying to murder man, you know, getting in the fast lane going around. So I'm just like glancing, glancing, glancing. And I'm like, I've been doing this podcast for 3 1/2 years now. And I'm sitting here like, right, really. I, I call it Jeremy. And I'm just like, I, like, I think I just saw something, dude. And he's like, all right, we'll break it down. What'd you see? And I was just like, all right, So kind of give him the description. I was like, I was like, I, I saw this thing that was not a cow. It was upright and it was running, right? And I was like, long strides, big long strides. Yeah, yeah. And he was just like, all right, well, what could it have been? Right? And we're just kind of break it down and we were talking for 25 minutes and I'm like, I'm like, all right.

40:05 So barring like an 8 foot tall Olympic athlete, full tilt running wearing a ghillie suit, you. Know. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, 98% sure that it was a Bigfoot and. Well, they got a lot of Bigfoot out there. Oklahoma's huge for that sort of stuff. All the crap investors and stuff say, yeah, you watch them break the tree lion, haul across the field and go into the next tree lion, you know, all the time they're just hauling across these fields and stuff. And so. And it's like, oh, cool. Jake didn't know that at the time. I had to send him article after article and like, dude, you know, you're, you're in Bigfoot territory, man. That's that's. That's Bigfoot country. He's like, where you at? Seeing. Fucking Bigfoot. He's like, where you at? Send me a screenshot. I mean, I'd rather have Jeremy's experience because then it would be like, you know, I'd be like, yes, that's exactly what I saw versus being like, I could have been a cow running on its hind legs, you know, come on. Yeah, who knows?

40:54 Maybe that all the time. Right. Yeah. It's probably a black bear sprinting on its hind legs, of course. Yeah. So to answer your question from before Tim, an hour and 30 minutes away from my home by car. Oh, OK, yeah. So that's. Pretty close, I think. In woods. In woods, you know? Yeah. Is that? Is that not? Is that 90 minute drive? Yeah. OK, so I bet it's actually closer in mileage in like actual distance because 90 minutes driving up there is like you're covering like 60 actual miles. It's like a fucking nightmare of like back roads and summer lane highways and shit. I'm looking at the path that it would take because I just looked it up on maps and you know, there's a big Crescent to it. So by the way, the crow flies, I'd say 50 miles. Yeah, so that's probably like in the same territory as that as the Bigfoot that are thought to be out there. I mean, it's pretty, Whitehall's pretty. I've been out there a few times and it's you look around and it's like I could see a Bigfoot living here. Like it's just mountains and just not, you know, tree, tons of tree covered mountains and shit. And it's like, well, you know, it's, it's the alpha predator of the area.

42:12 I could see how it would, it would do all right there, you know? Yeah, yeah, we had very, very early in the show, we had Kenny Irish on and he's he's from up that way and he was kind of breaking down the Beast for for me a little bit. But you know, I, I had watched like the monster quest episode on the Beast of Whitehall, and that's pretty much as far as my knowledge went on the whole thing. Honestly didn't even know I, when I first learned that Bigfoot was even a thing, which was like 12 or 13 years old. I was sitting at home sick from school and, and I was, I, I was watching the search of and they did that, that Patterson Gimlin special.

43:00 So I went into a whole bunch of, you know, trying to find whatever I could on on Bigfoot, which wasn't much because I don't, I think the Internet was like brand fucking new at the time. But basically it just was was that I found that it was pretty much a strictly Northwestern creature. And obviously, throughout the years, I've learned that that wasn't fucking true. Right, right. Yeah, seems to be. Yeah, seems to be like Pacific Northwest and some kind of like territory like in the New England deep Pennsylvania, that kind of maybe some kind of corridor, you know, and then it migrates. The best theory I've heard, it's like it's migratory maybe. So it's like might always be on the fucking move, you know what I mean?

43:49 So I I just do a loop around the country. I want to say it was in Lauren Coleman's book here that he had talked about blueberry patches and how they migrate with blueberries and that. Could be possible? Interesting. I'll tell you one thing that this portion of Vermont had in the springtime was fucking blueberries. Tons of them. Yeah. Oh yeah, All fucking. You know, this makes me wonder. You know, as you said, you've pretty much covered every category of thing you can through your years of podcasting and doing your show. So whether it's cryptozoology or paranormal or aliens or whatever, The thing is, what are the things that you really put more of your, I don't want to say faith, but more of your like, yeah, this probably exists through the amount of researchers you've had, you know, is it ghosts, aliens, you know, specific cryptic or something like that.

44:50 I like to hope that Bigfoot's real. So I mean, I think, I think that that's I still hold out hope that there's something to that, but I can't really stake like, you know, I I so maybe like the orang Pendek is a particularly intriguing creature that like lives Sumatra in these jungles that haven't, you know, been touched by human civilization. And they've been seen by native villagers and stuff there, but certainly not all the time. They're super elusive. They're like a little bipedal ape, essentially like a like a bipedal, yeah, like a little mini Bigfoot.

45:32 So I think that one seems more certainly like the kind of thing that if it happened tomorrow and they said they found one, I'd I'd believe it. They'd be like, oh, OK, that doesn't that doesn't stun me, you know what I mean? I'd be like, oh, wow. OK, so they finally got that you are in van deck, you know but. I suppose. Yeah, it's. But yeah, I mean, I kind of, I hope for the best with all this stuff. I don't say ghosts, I just believe in, but I think they're just kind of like like almost meteorological or something. Not that they are, but that's just kind of how I feel about. It's like it's a part of our universe. I don't understand it. It's like if you ask me to explain the fucking cloud, I couldn't tell you how a cloud works, honestly. And look, I went to Syracuse.

46:16 I say TV, radio and film. What do you want from me? I don't want a fucking cloud. So it's like, but ghosts are like clouds to me. They're just like they happen. There's so they exist. There's something to it, but we don't really know how it happens or what it even fucking means, you know? So that's, yeah, I've reached that point in my life with, with ghosts and sort of the, the, the afterlife type stuff and even like weird powers or whatever, like telepathy or mind reading or psychic stuff. It's like, there's clearly something to this, but how it works and why it works and all that is that's why, you know, we're still all kind of interested in it.

47:01 You know, I think it was your episode with James A Willis. I'm pretty sure I listened to it today where he really hit the nail on the head for me as far as why I give zero like weight in ghost existence. And it was just him crapping all over all the Ghost Hunter TV shows. Where there's like they're. Constantly looking, they're never finding anything. It's all this nonsense. All the equipment they use is baloney. You know, all this sort of stuff. He's breaking it all down. It's just a crappy radio, you know, all their spirit boxes and stuff. They're picking up a DJ, you know, all this sort of stuff. And I was like, man, I I give no credence to any of that stuff because of how dumb those shows are, because I just laugh at them. My wife's like, oh, did you see this one? I was like, no, I don't care.

47:48 Yeah, yeah. You know, it was really good. To kind of fill you in, Tim, a little bit about our show, we have four guys and we all have different points of view on all this stuff and you just. Have sightings? Do the other two guys have Bigfoot sightings too? It's a sky. No. So we have. Fucks going on? No, so Jeff is is your tinfoil hat conspiracy, fucking crazy dude. Love them to death. CJ is your your hauntings, your spirits, your occult, your mysticism, that kind of stuff. Jake's your skeptic and he also looks through everything at everything through a Christian point of view. And I just love fucking. Monsters. They're definitely demons, you know, Just like, there's no way. Well, I wouldn't put much too much credence in in, you know, in fucking any of this ghost hunting show stuff, you know what I mean?

48:42 Especially any of that equipment and stuff. It's. Like entertainment? Yeah, but I think everybody, I mean, most people have some kind of, they've had an experience or they know someone who's had an experience, someone they really trust, you know, who they don't wouldn't put them on, has had some kind of weird ghostly thing. And it's just, it's a weird, there's a weird naturalness to it. That's not, you know, where it's just like, oh, my grandma died. And then the next day, like I smelled her like like a month later. So it wouldn't have been, you know, like a like a year later, like I smelled her. But it's like, where the fuck did that, you know? But maybe that's just the brain. Maybe the brain. Maybe you're having a fucking stroke, right? Maybe. Maybe like.

49:24 Burt Toast all of a sudden. Yeah, Like, yeah, like maybe, maybe, Yeah. So but there's, there's all those weird little weird shit, little weird coincidences are really kind of like, you know, spooky. And I think that they they mean something. My, my mom, I want to get her on the show. But yeah, I mean, Christian lady, you know, even me as a Christian guy, I don't believe you go two places when you die, right? And, but even still, you know, she was a, an Air Force brat. Her, her dad, my grandpa was, was in the Air Force for 26 years. They did some time in England, one of the houses they lived on base in England. The woman went crazy, killed her kids, hung herself off the banister type stuff.

50:07 And when they moved into that house, 'cause it's not like they're going to demolish it. It's base housing, right? They're keep it up for forever until it's condemned. But they move into this house and she says it was all kinds of stuff. She would get pushed down the stairs, the the stove would turn on in the middle of the night and like, you know, towels would get thrown on top of the flames. All sorts of crazies would constantly happen. Then one day, grandpa comes inside after work. Grandma, you know, classic, you know, old school housewife had just been home with the kids all day long. And she's like, all this craziness is going on. They've been dealing with it for months. And he walks right into the front door and he says, if you don't knock this effing stuff off, I'm going to burn this house to the ground. And everything stops in that house for another year. And everything was done.

50:53 And then they he got orders back to the states. They moved away. She was five at the time, but she remembers all this craziness going on and grandma and grandpa took a trip, you know, years later, you know, 20 years later to go back to England, you know, he's out of the military. They want to go on this, you know, hey, wedding anniversary trip around let's go back to the old place. So they went back to the base. He gets on on base and they sure enough, the house is still there, right? You know, some of these buildings on these bases, 100 years old plus, right, still got asbestos and lead paint, who cares? But so they go to this house and, and they, they walk right up to the front door and they, they ring the doorbell and they're like, hey, you know, we used to live here so many years ago, all this sort of stuff.

51:36 Is she still here? And their faces went white. And they're like, you know about her. And they're like, yeah, you know, and, and she's. Just like she's just like making a movie, dude. And my mom's like, I don't know what to tell you. Like, I don't believe in ghosts, but there was something crazy there. There was all. Kinds of violence in that household. And something wild was going on there. And it, it went, you know, for years and years and years. And it's just like, I don't know, you know? Wild. But then you try to get into any like, oh, well, what are ghosts? And then you get into the ghost hunting shows and you just. Yeah. Yeah, they're just, they are just for entertainment. They're not really someone working. A fart next to someone else. Like I smell sulphur, you know, It's like. Weird, right, right.

52:21 Well, to like extend the analogy, like the ghost hunting shows are like if you were watching fucking people lying in a field, pointing up at the clouds and being like, that's, that's whatever, you know, trying to make, you know, look, that looks like a thing. It's a trying to tell me something and it's like, oh man, it's just a natural thing that's happening. You got to just kind of, you know, look at it that way maybe and take a different view of it. The ghost hunters. I mean, I guess, you know, I would try and run around with equipment and shit. It's like. But I mean, that's like everything too. You get the the Bigfoot hunters too. I mean, I don't know, I saw a meme a year ago and it was so funny. They're like all these ghosts or or Bigfoot hunters, they're out in the woods doing Bigfoot mating calls.

53:03 Like, what are they going to do when that thing breaks the tree line full tilt, Right? Yeah, right. No. No, no. You get, you get your answer if it's a red rocket or not. Yeah, for science. For science follow up question from what Jake asked you, have you ever had a guest come on that just completely changed your mind on something? Ah, shit, I don't know. I mean my mind, I mean, just made me kind of think more about different subjects, I guess. I can't think of anything where I was like, oh, I believe the accent. And then this guy came on and convinced me of why, you know what I mean?

53:48 Like like I was joking around with the song of the show the other night. It was like, I did do a show that was about this guy believes that his whole shtick was that meat horses eat meat. And it's like he had all these cases of meat eating horses and, and I suppose that changed my mind because I just, but I hadn't really even considered it. So it's more just like, oh, I, you know, I just thought that they ate regular grain and shit. But apparently he's like, you know, they also eat meat. And, you know, he argued for the case and why, you know, the powers that be don't want you to know this for, like, why exactly? I don't know.

54:29 But it's. Yeah. So that, that was kind of one of the more odd questions or guests that that I had that I was like, OK, well, I never really thought about it. I even said that on the show. I'm like, well, you kind of convinced me, dude, 'cause I don't, I didn't really have a take on it originally. I'm not super like, oh fuck you, fuck you. Where you get off that? Horses. Could eat meat like apparently people reacted to that like that way not on with the show, but just like with to this guy. So it's like, no, I mean, if you're all right, if you say so, dude, I mean, so it makes sense to me if you have all these incident reports and cases and shit of horses eating or biting people and sort of taking chunks out of them eating animals and shit. So I had.

55:15 My high school, we had a, we had an AG program because it's California, right? A lot of agriculture over there. And I had a buddy that was raising a a Black Angus steer and he fed it beef jerky once a week. I watched him do it and I he's like, kind of messed up, huh? I was like, yeah, kind of. I did right, too. I was like, all right, dude, OK. It's fucking messed up, man. So you got any projects coming up? Yes and no. We got put in all of America. Obviously show's going to keep going for a while at Banal of America, YouTube, Spotify, Apple, all that.

55:58 Just been in Banal of America, obviously coast to coast. I got a few trips in the works. The big one I should plug is Strange Realities conference that'll be in Nashville in November so people can check that out. I couldn't tell you what I'm going to be speaking about, but if it, if you're looking for a good time, this is, you know, it's kind of like we're, we've been turning it into like the paranormal party of the year. So we're hoping more people come this year too. But it's like me, Steve Burr, Josh Cutchin, the folks from the conspiratorial podcast or the folks who put on the event. It's it's Nashville, baby. It's it's, you know, the whole vibe is, is sort of like you get that vibe from the event super low key.

56:44 Tell the recording studio in Nashville and you can you get it, It's BYOB essentially you bring your beers. There's a fridge in the back. It's just super laid back. We're talking about maybe grilling this year, which would be fucking really cool If we can get that via the thumbs up on that. We we might be doing some grilling. So it's like a, it's like a paranormal conference meets a little bit of a tailgate party meets kind of like a little hootenanny kind of Nashvillian, you know, scene. So I highly recommend it. I've had a blast every year. People have a blast all the time. Every year.

57:24 They come, we hang out in the parking lot like like at the hotel late till late at night till they pretty much are like, you guys got to get out of here or something. So it's, it's a, it's a huge, it's a huge gathering and it's really kind of very just hang centric more than anything. It's like the presentations are great and awesome and everything, but the really there's a lot of downtime where people can do cool shit. So it's last year with the folks of us who stayed past to Sunday that night, maybe like 20 of us, most of the speakers, good amount of the attendees, anyone who really kind of had heard about it. Well, went out to the Bell Witch Cave and did like a whole walk through of the Bell Witch Cave at night, which was really awesome. Yeah.

58:11 And it was surreal, 'cause I'm in there with some of my best friends and some of these various people from the paranormal kids are so weird, 'cause I talk to them on the phone all the time. It's up. And here we are. It's me and Berg and Koch and Adam Sane and and Kiki Dombrowski and recluse Steven Snyder. We're all down in the fucking Bell Witch Cave wandering around and and getting creeped out and shit. And it was it was awesome. So that's I can't say I'm staying through Sunday again this year. If if there's a groundswell, maybe we'll do another trip up to the Belle witch cave. But either way, people to come. They can go to the fucking Belle witch cave. I'm an hour from Nashville. They maybe do a night tours that that weekend.

58:54 So strange realitiesconference.com check it out and Nah, that's about it for me really. I'll be up in Whitehall hanging out at the end of September for their Bigfoot conference and I'll be I'm just hanging out. I'm not a part of it. I just go I'm a huge booster of it. So and then the folks at Paranormal 5 are putting on a ghost hunt that night at unaffiliated with the conference. It's a great thing of timing. About an hour away near the city in Vermont. We're always staying Rutland. I don't know, you know, Brattleboro maybe, you know, Rutland. So I stay in Rutland.

59:34 I drive out to Whitehall, which is half hour away. I go to the festival. I'm coming back and I'm doing the ghost hunt. And anyone can fucking do that. Because like I said, I'm not a feeling like no one's paying me that. I'm buying tickets to these things. The the Whitehall Festival's free. So it's that's fine. But it's like, yeah. So, you know, go check out Paranormal 5I forget Wilson Castle ghost hunt if you're, if you're in the area, if you're going to go out to the Whitehall event, go to the fucking haunting afterwards 'cause it'll the ghost hunt 'cause it'll be cool. So that's it. But now the show's back, it's been back for like 8 months starting to like think of like it's been revived essentially. So now it's kind of like, OK, what, what do you, what do I want to do next?

1:00:18 Where do I want to take this to a different level? Now that I've been sort of doing this for six to eight months, so that I'm kind of, but I can't say anything for sure right now. That's it's been percolating in my mind lately. Like, all right, where, where am I going to take this next to the next level? So, yeah, something we'll probably have somebody who's in that regard, like maybe at the end of the summer or something like that. I have no idea. But and, and Coast to Coast AM, of course, is the website where you can find all the articles that I write every day. So yeah, lots of stuff from Bernal. That's so fucking cool. I mean, like, like, like you said, coast to coast was my gateway drug to all this shit. I mean it's.

1:00:59 Fantastic, man. It's an institution. I I love the place. Love. Huge fan of George Nori, just such a such a fucking awesome guy. Connie Willis is good. You know, any, anybody that they have in there is just fucking phenomenal right now to kind of dig into some of your, your, your, your past explorations, if you will. You know, long time listeners in the infant rabbit hole. We jumped into the Berkshire UFO incident and you actually went and did some research into the Bridgewater Triangle. How was that? Yeah, yeah, a long time ago.

1:01:39 A long, long time ago. That was like 15 years ago. I went with Chris Belzano. I don't know if you know that that his name, but he wrote Dark Woods about the Freetown State Forest. He used to live up here. He ended up moving down to Florida like shit, maybe over a decade ago, probably now. And we we went, it's a difficult place to explore the Bridgewater Triangle. It's I'm not a huge fan, to be quite honest. It's kind of like it's a whole amalgamation of stories like when people come to visit me and they like if they go, oh, I want to see the Bridgewater Triangle, I'm like, no, no, no, you know, it's it's like just a giant swamp.

1:02:23 It's a it's a one place is like a, a horse race track that somebody saw a Black Panther once. There's some Native American stuff there that's like in Freetown State Forest. Like you can walk in there and kind of check it out, but it's like this really. It's all spread out and it's all anecdotal, sort of like tails. So if somebody comes to visit and you're like, let's go, you know, you take him and this is the racetrack where the guy saw the thing. It's like it can get kind of. But anyway, so we did do that. Chris took me out to show me. But the odd part was is that we, we we're like out in the field and there's a dirt Rd. run down the field and he went to try a three-point turn on the field and fucking like got his car stuck. So we were like stuck in this field in Bridgewater Triangle for like 2 hours while he waited for, while he waited for AAA to come and like yank his car out of the out of the off the road. You know, he fucked up the turn.

1:03:27 I think that's what. But Don, he'd been refreshing my memory if he was here, but I think that so it's just a nightmare. It was kind of like, and to me it was like, all right, maybe that's that was kind of, I was writing an article for the Coast to coast. They had a newsletter at the time, like a magazine. So I was writing a article for their magazine about the British Water Triangle. That was the whole point of driving down there with Chris. And so it kind of was that was, I don't know. It's I guess in one way it's like, oh, you're just trying to make it sound interesting in a way, like like you just try to like, but maybe it part of me was just like, that's maybe that's the fucking weirdness of it. Maybe that was it. Like I was trying to, I was trying to like look around this place and get to the bottom of it to write about it for a magazine. And it was like, no, that's not fucking happening. So you're you're going to just stay here in the dirt Rd. for a while, not see like half the shit you were going to check out.

1:04:23 So it's it was kind of weird, you know what I mean? It was just kind of weird. Like don't often find myself in situations where the car breaks down kind of things and I'm stuck for a long time. Like in that regard, some unexpected situations like that. So, yeah, but that was the, that was my Bridgewater Triangle exploration. It's a little bit South of me. It's about 90 minutes, SI mean hour or so. Yeah. So it's not too, it's more of a pain in the ass for me to kind of go down there. I don't drive all that much. So I fucking have to organize, you know, orchestrate these things. But I'm more of a, I'm more of a America's Stonehenge fan because that's about 1/2 hour north of me. I'm also a huge like kind of, I like it as our roadside attraction, but it's not really particularly like thrilling because I've been there like a million times. So it's like, you know, but if someone comes to visit, that's where I generally take them because. That's red.

1:05:25 Right on, man. It's got at least kind of a weird it was been on In Search of a long time ago I guess. So it sure was last one, man Oak Island. Oh, I love Oak Island. Do you find all this old shit? Yeah. How'd you find all this old shit that I did? That's pretty awesome. I can't give away my sources. No, I'm just kidding, Google. You must have found. An old. Found an old bio that I had written a long time ago. Yeah. So I, I've been on Oak Island, I've explored Oak Island. I was lucky enough this was also very long ago. Like you're bringing up a lot of deep cut shit that was like from 2000 and like 567.

1:06:10 This was 2007 that I went up there. So now we're that's 15 years ago. So I went up to Nova Scotia to visit my friend, film maker Paul Kimball. He's a, he's ATV ghost hunter now. Actually he started a UFO. So now he's a TV ghost hunter, so I'm sure he'll appreciate your your teeth, Jake. Anyway, it just so happens very lucky kind of turn of events. This guy the opposite of the bourgeois triangle thing. I don't even know if I knew this was happening the weekend I was up there. But as as it happened, it was a oh, it did because Paul, I think, was speaking there or filming something. But there was like Oak Island conference and it was held like at the town next to Oak Island and there's AI don't know what you call it a breezeway. I don't know what what's it called this? The like a man made Rd. out to an island, a bridge. I guess I thought there was a more technical term for it. Like like a dirt Rd.

1:07:13 Like it was like a dirt like somehow they had just dumped a bunch of dirt to get out. To Oh yeah. Do you know what I'm saying? It's just kind. Of weather or something? When I when I was stationed in Pax River, we went down to Key West and there was, there's a couple of those down there. Right. You got to say I don't know what they're called. They must have. They have a I'm sure they have some. Yeah, but bridge is perfectly fine. It's more accurate. So there is a road bridge like that goes out to Rock Island. Now you can't go there at the time, but for this weekend, this is the lucky break of it all. So it was like if I had been gone up to can, if you gone up to can any other time you couldn't you could drive out there. But I think they were like it's before the TV show.

1:07:54 So they were the Laganas had just bought Oak Island and so this was way before they even thought of doing ATV show. They this was like right after they bought it. I think this, I don't know if it was they're doing the, the conference, but it was really a small low key little Canadian town, maybe like 50 people at the thing. It was awesome. It was very informative or unique experience. Then you could go out to Oak Island on, you know, with unfettered not, you know, allowed. You were allowed 'cause otherwise, I don't know, I think they would call the cops or like maybe the gate was to the island was probably locked. I think maybe so you couldn't drive out there.

1:08:34 Yeah, there was a gate and everything, so you're a lot out there. So we went out there and like, looked around, saw. Oh, and we could, we could. I don't know how familiar you are with the story, but we could follow up this in years. But there's a pit. Yeah. Where people died and shit and and you. A pic in that that can never be completely excavated. And you could go up and look down into the pit. So it was a real, now that I think about it, it was really kind of like a once in a lifetime experience. Because then shortly thereafter, I met the Laganas at a hotel. We went to the nearby hotel to get a drink after and we were just sitting on the patio and they were out there. I just like they weren't celebrities or anything like that.

1:09:20 They were just like a bunch of rich guys from Michigan who had bought, who had just bought Oak Island. So I just said, hey, you know, Congrats and everything. And you know, I, it's just sort of a real short friendly conversation, but nothing like nothing of, of substance. So don't worry, Jake. Next thing I know, a few years later, seven or eight years later, I see they they started ATV show. So I don't watch the TV show. I don't really, you know. Is that still going? I believe it is. Really. It's it's been on for a while then. Yeah, I think they're starting to like stretch it out now where they do a new season like every two years or something like that, but I don't know. But I'm pretty sure it's still on. And I think they're probably up to like season eight or nine or something like that.

1:10:06 So it's kind of one of those it's like Bigfoot hunters. It's like hunt for the skinwalker. It's like. Or skinwalk, whatever. Is that the Skinwalker Ranch show? I don't know but. My wife is obsessed with that. Yeah, but they're all kind of the same. And it's like the Oak Island and the Skinwalker show, I'm pretty sure from the same production company even. So it's just kind of like, it's very, people love them, they're great, they're really popular shows. But it's just like you can kind of clearly tell they're entertainment or something because it's like you're never, you never get. You always just get a little, like, you're always like, get a little bit closer, but it doesn't quite pan out. And then the episode ends like, you know. What I mean at least someone on there that demands he gets called a ridiculous nickname like Dragon. Yeah, yeah.

1:10:55 Panther. Yeah, so that was my visit to Oak Island. It was. Yeah. It was cool. It was a cool, really cool experience. Like I said, I hadn't thought of in a long, long time. I think I watched that like maybe first couple episodes and it just, it lost me. I, I like the, the lore and everything behind it. I like the like I looked into the science and, and stuff about that pit and how it can never be, you know, excavated and how there's supposed to be something underneath there. But we'll never know because it just the way that the, the geology of, of that island is just keeps getting filled up with water because of the, the water line and everything. Not very interesting stuff, man.

1:11:41 Let's see now that's I, Tim. I think that's it, man. All right. Wow, Jake. You got anything? No, but this has been a sick interview. Thank you. Yeah. No, man, I really do appreciate you. You want to go ahead and tell everybody where they can. Yeah, I feel like I did the whole plug thing earlier, but I'll do a quick one now. But All America, BINNALL ofamerica.com or just punch in Benall, BINNALL of America on Google or whatever. You'll find my stuff. Coast to Coast AM is the obviously the coast to coast websites, coasttocoastam.com.

1:12:22 You can find all my articles there under Articles. They all have my byline on them and everything. Be sure to check those out. Because I said, like I said, really trying to get into the weirdly weird obscure stuff over there. It's fun because I like, because I'll post something then like two or three days later I'll see it pop up at like four other news sites I go to for weird news and I'm like, oh, I wonder where you found that Malaysian Banshee story there? Fucking weird news central. Like I just stumble upon that that's crazy story that fucking is only available in in Malaysian language that you have to, you know, run through Google Translate to figure out and everything. But yeah, check it out coasttocoastam.com. But all of America is the podcast. Strange Realities conference is the party down in Nashville. And those are the three big things. So check them out.

1:13:14 Sweet. Sweet. Man, thank you guys for having me on the show. I really. Appreciate it for sure. Yeah, I'm going to kill you, man. It's fun. Chatting with you, it's. Awesome. Hell yeah. All right, well, that's been another episode of the Infinite Rabbit Hole podcast. Until next time, travellers, we'll see you the next fork in the path of the Infinite Rabbit Hole. Take it easy. Bye.